Horn after Time-Serving Penalty

[Sonny]

Had an interesting situation during a recent local H.S. game - The coach (an experienced, retired referee) wanted a horn after a time-serving penalty was relayed to the bench. The timer sounded the horn, after which I said no horn. I explained to him that he had 20-seconds to substitute but that we didn't blow the horn in that situation. He was adamtant that a horn was available then and should be sounded.

Thoughts?

Experienced refs - Did either NCAA or the Federation rulebook state that you sounded a horn in this game situation in years past?

Rule 4, Sec. 21/A seems to support me in the NCAA book. Don't have the Fed book handy.

[Jac Coyne]

Horn is rather redundant in that situation. Does he want one after a goal, too?

[LaxRef]

Had an interesting situation during a recent local H.S. game - The coach (an experienced, retired referee) wanted a horn after a time-serving penalty was relayed to the bench. The timer sounded the horn, after which I said no horn. I explained to him that he had 20-seconds to substitute but that we didn't blow the horn in that situation. He was adamtant that a horn was available then and should be sounded.

Thoughts?

Experienced refs - Did either NCAA or the Federation rulebook state that you sounded a horn in this game situation in years past?

Rule 4, Sec. 21/A seems to support me in the NCAA book. Don't have the Fed book handy.

The NFHS rules say you have to sound a horn if you want to do regular subs after a goal or a time-serving penalty (see NFHS 4-22-2-b). The NCAA rules used to say the same thing. I submitted a change to both NCAA and NFHS on this, basically saying that you are allowed to have regular subs in these situations without a horn. (See NCAA 4-21-a)

Guess what happened? NCAA included the change, NFHS did not. So the coach was right in terms of the letter of the law, but that's not the practice.

[horn17]

so in other words...you can ask for a horn after a time serving penalty has been called to sub in the HS game??

I have rules interpretation meeting tonight, and will ask about this as well...but not in front of the other coaches...

[LaxRef]

so in other words...you can ask for a horn after a time serving penalty has been called to sub in the HS game??

I have rules interpretation meeting tonight, and will ask about this as well...but not in front of the other coaches...

According to the rules, yes.

According to common practice by any official who's been around the game for more than 20 minutes, no.

[LaxRef]

Horn is rather redundant in that situation. Does he want one after a goal, too?

If so, he's obviously a coach who's reading the rules, because that's what the rules require. But that's not how we do it in the real world.

[horn17]

Horn is rather redundant in that situation. Does he want one after a goal, too?

If so, he's obviously a coach who's reading the rules, because that's what the rules require. But that's not how we do it in the real world.

Is that Real World Atlanta, Austin, or Australia???

[LaxRef]

Horn is rather redundant in that situation. Does he want one after a goal, too?

If so, he's obviously a coach who's reading the rules, because that's what the rules require. But that's not how we do it in the real world.

Is that Real World Atlanta, Austin, or Australia???

It's the "real world," not "The Real World."