3rd MDIA Div. B Poll (3/24/05). Thoughts, Predictions, etc.

[CyLaxKeeper00]

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[Andy Sharp]

Since it is still somewhat difficult to rank teams nationally, maybe if people would venture to rank their own conferences, we'd be able to get some useful info posted.

How would you rank teams in your conference?

I am wondering . . . was the App State win over Davidson an upset or do they truly belong ranked above them?

I would hope that whoever voted Creighton and Puget Sound #1 take a look at the games in Boise and Durango into consideration to gauge the strength of each conference.

My trip out to CA, UT, & CO was not cause for any revelation, at least in my votes. I can say that I now feel secure in voting my Calvin team in the top 5.

I've mentioned previously that Ft. Lewis should not be dismissed. I watched my video of them against UVSC this morning and still feel that that game was not as decisive as the 16-9 score suggests, early on if one or two of their great scoring opps had converted they could have changed the outcome. UVSC is good but not beyond FLC's reach.

San Diego looked sharp, they are quicker than most and really seemed to settle the ball well and work it around, rarely missing passes. Since I've only seen them against Ft. Lewis' in-tight defense, what I would really like to know is how well they perform against a more aggressive (hitting & pressure) defense. [I edited this paragraph after watching them on DVD again]

Calvin gets our regular season started late on Wednesday, just a bit too late to be taken into consideration for this poll. We're playing Central Michigan (rematch of last year's CCLA championship and our only loss of last season, in our first game also) who is now in Division A. Should be interesting, they appear improved, having beaten Western Michigan & Purdue already, and with them on their 11th game and us in our 1st in 7 weeks, we'll see how things shape up.

Good luck to all voters, please share any insights you might have.

[Maple Leaf]

andy you seem to be the resident expert on the b division this year... while you might not have expert knowledge of each individual conference... you have seen by far the most conferences in action. I am wondering if you have any insights in to what you think the strongest conferences are. From that point it might be easier for pollsters to rank the teams.

For example, when ft. lewis played the wcll teams they did not score many goals, but against rmlc and lsa teams their goal scoring increased dramatically. Is this an indication of different styles of play, or just a random fluke?

[Andy Sharp]

For example, when ft. lewis played the wcll teams they did not score many goals, but against rmlc and lsa teams their goal scoring increased dramatically. Is this an indication of different styles of play, or just a random fluke?

Even with the games I have seen of the WCLL, RMLC, LSA, and UMLL it is still not enough to judge whole conferences. I've seen other posters in A try to rate RMLC vs WCLL and can see that it's nearly impossible to convince either the other is better, it's only heats up the message board. As has been said, any given day . . . if I had to choose between the top teams of those two, I'd go according to the scoreboard.

The CCLA is just barely getting started and by early April we'll all have a better idea of what level of play Grove City and Indiana U of PA bring to our conference. And don't forget Taylor, they lost their leading scorer/coach, but it does not appear that they've had any problems scoring so far this year with a 17-4 win over what I thought was going to be an improved Grand Valley.

My black hole is the SELC among others, talk to me SELC.

[Kyle Berggren]

I would hope that the way we played in Boise is not representative of how good we are as a conference. I'd say that we have about 4 teams, probably 6, that would competetive for the RMLC title in the B division. UVSC is very good, not to take anything against Boise St., but they are the team to beat in the RMLC. PLU played a good game against them, but not up to their normal, and they didn't have the best weekend shooting. We essentially died during the UVSC game. We were missing a handful of players, and from the game I watched, I think our minds were with the missing players. I got frustrated, and I believe it carried over to my players, and the negative attitude flowed through most of the game. Maybe it was the long drive and getting in at 2 am, I don't know, but we'll try to make sure we don't embarrass ourselves again.

With all that being said, voters don't have a lot to go on other than our performances. We can't really vote on what coulda and shoulda happened. As far as our first place vote.... I was really shocked, appreciative, and I think we can be there, but shocked. After what Claremont and St. John's were doing, it's nice to see that someone still thinks the PNCLL B is a tough division. Inconsistency makes it really tough. PLU loses a close one to UVSC and Boise, but beat Linfield. We beat PLU, were blown out by UVSC, beat by Boise in a close one, and lost to Linfield.... Isn't that fun for voters! I've already recieved a few emails from other voters asking for a little bit of insight into what's going on out here, so know that people do care, and are trying.

Another tough part, is as Andy mentioned some other "factors," a lot of things simply can't be discussed on this website, yet there is not a national forum to discuss such things (not that there should be, and I'm NOT criticizing). I'm sure some voters talk privately about them when they ask the right questions. If anyone has any questions about a certain team, I would ask them directly, or an opponent via email (possibly both).

[Gregg Pathiakis]

How would you rank teams in your conference?

Well, we are still extremely early in our season, especially division B, but here's how I would rank our long list of D-B teams..

1. Coast Guard
2. New Haven
3. Central Conn.
4. Framingham (no one has seen them yet... so who knows)

[mcneito]

All I have seen is people making excuses as to why they lost to UVSC, or what plays would have brought them back in the game against UVSC etc. Why can' t it just be- UVSC is good. They have beaten each ranked opponent they have played, all of them on the road. UVSC deserves to be up there in the top 3 no matter what excuse you come up with- they have a zero in the loss column. Andy, you want Calvin to be ranked in the top 5- play someone. Prove it. I know you have a good opinion and we all appreciate your insight and the effort you have put in to see all top div. B teams, but your opinion obviously favors YOUR squad. I don't think Calvin has proven anything to rank them that high. And that's MY opinion.

[LAX SAMURAI]

Best post to date.

[Daniel Morris]

All I have seen is people making excuses as to why they lost to UVSC, or what plays would have brought them back in the game against UVSC etc. Why can' t it just be- UVSC is good. They have beaten each ranked opponent they have played, all of them on the road. UVSC deserves to be up there in the top 3 no matter what excuse you come up with- they have a zero in the loss column. Andy, you want Calvin to be ranked in the top 5- play someone. Prove it. I know you have a good opinion and we all appreciate your insight and the effort you have put in to see all top div. B teams, but your opinion obviously favors YOUR squad. I don't think Calvin has proven anything to rank them that high. And that's MY opinion.

I have to agree. I have been working on this Division B poll all day and can't figure out how Calvin nabbed a #3 spot. UVSC will move up in the poll tomorrow. With the defeat of 5 ranked opponents they are playing very well right now.

[Kyle Berggren]

If I remember correctly Calvin was a top 5 poll team last year, and #1 laxpower, but I could be wrong. As far as play somebody, do we drop them out of the poll until they do? Where would you recommend we put them? what is the cutoff for "someone?"

If my above post was taken as an excuse for my team losing, that's not the origional intention. I was trying to defend our league, and point out, how inconsistent our league has been. I do still believe that we can play with UVSC, I would like to play them again. I'm not trying to take anything away from UVSC. They were a great team, and a great group of guys. In another thread I think I used the word "dominated" regarding our game. I'm still trying to figure out if they take over my number 1 spot on my poll.... It will be very close. Good luck to all, I hope you guys don't see my post as grandstanding for my team, that was not the intention, just some observations now that I've seen the a few of the best from both leagues.

[asulax42]

I know I have a bias opinion on this, but Appalachian State's win over Davidson was not a fluke. If anything we played really poorly. We had just returned from spring break and because of the snow hadn't been able to practice in 2 weeks.

[Daniel Morris]

I think Appalachian will have some vertical movement in this poll.

[Tim Gray]

How would you rank teams in your conference?

Well, we are still extremely early in our season, especially division B, but here's how I would rank our long list of D-B teams..

1. Coast Guard
2. New Haven
3. Central Conn.
4. Framingham (no one has seen them yet... so who knows)

Since CCSU is 2-1 right now with a win over New HAven, I would put them at 1 followed by Coast Guard, New Haven, then Framingham. I hate when teams are ranked based on expectations and previous years results. Coast Gaurd hasn't played yet, so should not be ranked over CCSU at this point.

[mcneito]

Samurai and Dan, I am glad to see that someone else sees what I see. I looked at the schedule and taking nothing away from these teams, but St. Johns only ranked opponent was TX-Arlington, I respect St. Johns because they scheduled a trip to Texas to play some tough opponents. But Calvin doesn't have anyone ranked except IUPUI. I would give the nod to teams like Pacific Lutheran and Puget Sound and Ft. Lewis who go out and schedule some tough opponents, and lose than a team who plays a "padded" schedule and is ranked purely on last year's performance. I guess it will pay off when Blaine comes around and some teams have experience against tough opponents. But this is purely MY opinion.

[Andy Sharp]

I had a post ready that would have explained my opinions better but left for our game before submitting it, wish I would have been around to step up.

In case you're wondering, a quick check of a weather map would tell you why teams in the midwest and NE haven't been playing (high of 37, low of 22 today), there is still snow on the ground here and there has been for the past 3 months. Surely the climate of a team should not cost them X notches lower in polls. The tournament will be played in one location, so it all gets equalized in the end.

While I put effort into trying to educate myself for these polls and make my votes as logical as I can, the only thing that will matter in the end is who wins their conference championship games.

mcneito, there is nothing in your post regarding UVSC that I wouldn't agree with, did I ever say you weren't good? My last vote for you guys in the top 3 will remain. Your scores speak for themselves.

Back to an earlier thought:

Another tough part, is as Andy mentioned some other "factors," a lot of things simply can't be discussed on this website

I was not speaking of those factors, just the regular ones of playing on the road, early in the season, just after spring break, without having practiced outdoors, injuries, missing guys, long van ride, yada, yada. Nearly all of us use these excuses from time to time, I just did not want to put words in Fort Lewis' mouth.

In case you're wondering we took a nice reality check tonight at CMU, 14-5 or something, you won't hear me boasting about my team anytime soon. Our play was not pretty, but we bounced back last year from a 1st game CMU loss, hopefully history repeats itself.

mcneito and samarai, if you wouldn't mind adding a real avatar to your profiles, it would be nice to know where your affiliations stand.