4/11/07 Division A Poll is out!

[PSLguy]

BC beats Northeastern 7-6. BC never trailed after Northeastern scored the 1st goal.

This should shake things up a little bit.

I don't see why. BC is a solid team which one might say short of the loss to UCSB had the exact same credentials as Northeastern coming into this game. We've seen a lot of top teams lose and not suffer significantly for it in the polls. I see no reason why NU's loss should do so for them. A spot or two at the most is all this is worth IMO.

[JerzWB]

We've seen a lot of top teams lose and not suffer significantly for it in the polls. I see no reason why NU's loss should do so for them. A spot or two at the most is all this is worth IMO.

All of those "top teams" have played top competition all year long. They have a bunch of quality wins/games to back up one loss. NE vs. ranked opponents 1-1. They could end up anywhere from 10-16

[TMcCourt]

The west coast bias on these boards is amazing. The top part of the PCLL is vastly underrated. BC and NU are two teams that traveled out to the west coast and played a total of 8 WCLL teams going 7-1. BC beat #24 Claremont 14-7 (11-3), USC 15-4 (6-7) and lost to #10 UCSB 8-5 (11-3) during their first three games of the season (The UCSB loss was UCSB's 11th game of the season by the way). They have also beaten NC St. 13-2. NU beat San Diego st. 14-6 (4-9), UCSD 14-6 (3-9), San Diego 10-9 (3-8 ) and #12 Arizona 10-4 (11-4) during 4 of their first 5 games of the season. They have also beaten NC St. 17-4. UConn did not travel this season but is sitting at 5-0 in the PCLL and will have to get through BC and NU to prove themselves.

I don't have the time or the effort to go into the bottom parts of the PCLL but it is clear to me that these two teams are quality programs that would compete for the WCLL title. To expect them to take 2 or, as some people have indicated, even 3 trips out west when the west coast teams have never even considered traveling out east is completely unrealistic. It isn't within budget or time constraints.

I don't believe that NU deserved a No. 1 vote but some voter out there did. However, that does not mean that BC beating NU 7-6 makes NU overrated. It could mean that BC was actually very underrated. No one would want to drop one of the top ten teams in the country very far for a three goal loss to UCSB during their third game of the season. UCSB has proven year in and year out to be an extremely quality program. Let's all stop complaining about NU receiving one vote and realize that their is finally some parity in this league and it is a good thing.

[More Cowbell]

All of those "top teams" have played top competition all year long. They have a bunch of quality wins/games to back up one loss. NE vs. ranked opponents 1-1. They could end up anywhere from 10-16

I don't see how they could really drop very far. I have to agree with PSL in that they should only drop one or 2 spots. Think about it...right now they are #9. I can see them dropping behind UCSB and FSU, but further than that...i dont know. #12 is Arizona, who NU beat convincingly earlier in the year. After that the 13-16 slots have a combined record of 7-15 vs ranked opponents. If Utah and Lindenwood can stay put or even move up after a number of losses, why would NU drop way down?

Lindenwood 1-5
Cal Poly 1-3
Utah 3-5 (3-6 w/ chapman)
Texas A&M 1-2

Let's all stop complaining about NU receiving one vote and realize that their is finally some parity in this league and it is a good thing.

I agree. It is frustrating that people seem to be unable to accept that there may be more than 1 good team in a league that isnt the WCLL or RMLC. Maybe this is the year for a more balanced (conference-wise) national tournament

shameless plug:

However, that does not mean that BC beating NU 7-6 makes NU overrated. It could mean that BC was actually very underrated.

....think about it..

[Danny Hogan]

Utah beat UCSB and UMd as well as their 1 goal win over #25, no?

[More Cowbell]

oops...edited above

[sohotrightnow]

The west coast bias on these boards is amazing. The top part of the PCLL is vastly underrated. BC and NU are two teams that traveled out to the west coast and played a total of 8 WCLL teams going 7-1. BC beat #24 Claremont 14-7 (11-3), USC 15-4 (6-7) and lost to #10 UCSB 8-5 (11-3) during their first three games of the season (The UCSB loss was UCSB's 11th game of the season by the way). They have also beaten NC St. 13-2. NU beat San Diego st. 14-6 (4-9), UCSD 14-6 (3-9), San Diego 10-9 (3-8 ) and #12 Arizona 10-4 (11-4) during 4 of their first 5 games of the season. They have also beaten NC St. 17-4. UConn did not travel this season but is sitting at 5-0 in the PCLL and will have to get through BC and NU to prove themselves.

Maybe there is a west coast bias because every year some team from another league claims to be the second coming of Syracuse and gets destroyed by a WCLL or RMLC team in the tournament. BC and NU combined for 2 wins over ranked teams on their trip out west, and Claremont was just ranked this past week. I'm glad that teams from other leagues are starting to do well though. Maybe they can try to win more than one game in the tournament so the west coast bias can be eradicated.

[univduke21]

West coast bias..... Well maybe because

the last 6 years in team in the finals was from either the RMLC or the WCLL. Not to mention over the last 3 years there have been 12 teams compete in the semi-finals, and 10 of the 12 were from the RMLC or WCLL. I understand that there is some frustration on teams and supporters from outside those conferences, but until there is a consistant breakthrough there will continue to be this "west coast bias"

[Danny Hogan]

10/12 is a misleading statement because 9/10 were CSU, BYU, UCSB, SSU.

those teams deserve every sort of bias they recieve, i think some people have a bone of contention with a few of the bubble teams from those conferences getting the benefit of the doubt.

[TMcCourt]

I apologize if I offended anyone with my post. I simply meant there is a league bias out there. Sonoma, BYU, UCSB, CSU and in my mind Michigan (one can make a case for Colorado as well) have proven themselves to be teams that are talented year in and year out. These teams are great teams. However, my post was intended to be interpreted to mean that if two PCLL teams, in the beginning of their seasons, can go out and go 7-1 against good WCLL teams, in the middle of their seasons, and lose to the class of the WCLL 8-5 in what appears to have been a close game thoughout (I was not there), then would those two PCLL teams not be competing for the WCLL title if they were on the west coast?

It appears to me that each league seems to be slightly top heavy. The PCLL may be more top heavy then some of the west coast leagues but it does not make the teams at the top worse.

Also, I recognize that in the past the WCLL and RMLC have had the best teams in the tournament. I also recognize that this may continue to take place into the future. However, we are not talking about the past. We are talking about current polls and current seedings. That would mean we need to dissect what has happened THIS year instead of falling back on records that took plays during years when BC, NU and other teams (FSU?) were still trying to establish and build interest in their programs.

[univduke21]

We are talking about current polls and current seedings. That would mean we need to dissect what has happened THIS year instead of falling back on records that took plays during years when BC, NU and other teams (FSU?) were still trying to establish and build interest in their programs.

I understand we are not talking about the past, but to understand the future you must understand the past. Until teams outside those 6 mentioned teams start performing on a consistant basis at the national tournment then they will always have "baggage" when you talk about the polls leading up to the tournament. You will get your chance to prove yourself but until you do, nothing is due to you.

[NKlaxguy]

The west coast bias on these boards is amazing. The top part of the PCLL is vastly underrated. BC and NU are two teams that traveled out to the west coast and played a total of 8 WCLL teams going 7-1. BC beat #24 Claremont 14-7 (11-3), USC 15-4 (6-7) and lost to #10 UCSB 8-5 (11-3) during their first three games of the season (The UCSB loss was UCSB's 11th game of the season by the way). They have also beaten NC St. 13-2. NU beat San Diego st. 14-6 (4-9), UCSD 14-6 (3-9), San Diego 10-9 (3-8 ) and #12 Arizona 10-4 (11-4) during 4 of their first 5 games of the season. They have also beaten NC St. 17-4. UConn did not travel this season but is sitting at 5-0 in the PCLL and will have to get through BC and NU to prove themselves.

I don't have the time or the effort to go into the bottom parts of the PCLL but it is clear to me that these two teams are quality programs that would compete for the WCLL title. To expect them to take 2 or, as some people have indicated, even 3 trips out west when the west coast teams have never even considered traveling out east is completely unrealistic. It isn't within budget or time constraints.

I don't believe that NU deserved a No. 1 vote but some voter out there did. However, that does not mean that BC beating NU 7-6 makes NU overrated. It could mean that BC was actually very underrated. No one would want to drop one of the top ten teams in the country very far for a three goal loss to UCSB during their third game of the season. UCSB has proven year in and year out to be an extremely quality program. Let's all stop complaining about NU receiving one vote and realize that their is finally some parity in this league and it is a good thing.

Best post I've read all year. Probably because I have an east coast bias though.

Sonny, I am curious what the geographic distribution of the poll voters is. Is there 4 or 5 voters affiliated with each conference? I suppose some are not affiliated with any conference. If anyone has a general feel of the voters it's you, is their a larger number of voters west of the mississippi? Just curious.

[Danny Hogan]

2007 Shamrock Lacrosse MCLA Division A Top 25 Poll Voters (in alphabetical order, 40 total):
Mike Allan, Mike Annala, Ken Broschart, Ben Clark, Chad Donnelly, Noah Fink, John Galvin, Rob Graff, Tim Gray, Buff Grubb, Bill Harkins, Ryan Hanavan, Matt Holtz, Troy Hood, Brent Hoskins, Will Jenner, Joe Kerwin, Rene Kozarsky, Jason Lamb, Chris Larson, Rich Levi, Ken Lovic, Karl Lynch, Albert Man, Dino Mattesich, Craig Miller, Dan Morris, Brian Mosher, Scott Murphy, Aaron Myers, Flip Naumburg, Panchito Ojeda, John Paul, Sonny Pieper, Gary Podesta, John Robinette, Tim Rourk, Tony Scazzero, AJ Stevens, and Dan Wishengrad.

[NKlaxguy]

Well ya I know where I can get the names of the people but I have no idea who 90% of those people are or what teams they are affiliated with if any.

[TMcCourt]

Actually, UnivDuke21, you are mistaken I won't get my chance to prove it. I am not playing in the league anymore and haven't for quite some time. I wish I could help but my eligibility is long gone. I simply check in on the boards now and again and saw a lot of people complaining about NU and thier ranking because they haven't played enough teams on the west coast. I completely understand the past and believe it or not still think the polls should be based on THIS season's results. And it appears that THIS season, NU and BC could compete for the WCLL title.