3/7/07 Division B poll is out!

[Kyle Berggren]

I've been big on the RMLC-B all year, but not big enough. I'm working on my poll now, but they'll most likely have 4 teams in my top 10... UMLL 2... PNCLL 2...

[unclaxman23]

1. St. Johns
2. St. Thomas
3.Westminster
4.Dayton
5.unc
6.Harding
7.uvsc
8.emory
9. Montana State
10.Montana
11.Western Washington
12.Fort Lewis
13.calvin
14.Eckard
15.Irvine

I think that this is what the next poll should look like

[woulax4]

[quote="unclaxman23"]1. St. Johns
2. St. Thomas
3.Westminster
4.Dayton
5.unc
6.Harding
7.uvsc
8.emory
9. Montana State
10.Western Washington
11.Fort Lewis
12.calvin
13.Eckard
14.Irvine
15.mines

I think that this is what the next poll should look like[/quote]

So first off you have the school of the mines making their first apperience in the polls at #15 with a 6-4 record with their only top 25 win from #20 Irvine by one.

Than you have Irvine moving up six spots after losing their last three games, only one of which was to a top 25 team and that was #25 Western Oregon by three.

And finally you have Montana dropping out of the top 15 all together with there only losses coming to #4 Utah Valley and #13 Montana State by a combined four goals.

[unclaxman23]

yeah you bring up good points i had made this list a little while back and forgot to post it i cant belive i didnt put montana in the top ten glad that you saw this soon, so i dont look to stupid, but you are right about montana for sure. As for mines they have areally tallented bunch that has done well in occ and i think that if they didn t play in the rmlc b they would be at the top of alot of other leagues.

[Brew26]

well mines beat Irvine and only lost by 1 to Montana State who beat Montana and Western Washington. But I dont see mines at 15 but in the top 25. A side note, Carnegie Mellon moved to 19 from being unranked with only one win over augustana. So, its possible to jump around a lot from 15 to 25.

[scooter]

1. St. Johns
2. St. Thomas
3.Westminster
4.Dayton
5.unc
6.Harding
7.uvsc
8.emory
9. Montana State
10.Western Washington
11.Fort Lewis
12.calvin
13.Eckard
14.Irvine
15.mines

I think that this is what the next poll should look like

So first off you have the school of the mines making their first apperience in the polls at #15 with a 6-4 record with their only top 25 win from #20 Irvine by one.

Than you have Irvine moving up six spots after losing their last three games, only one of which was to a top 25 team and that was #25 Western Oregon by three.

And finally you have Montana dropping out of the top 15 all together with there only losses coming to #4 Utah Valley and #13 Montana State by a combined four goals.

I'm inclined to agree here....there seems to be a ton of conference love with unclaxman

[woulax23]

I hate to toot my own horn here, but i can't understand Irvine, who has a less than five hundred record in their B versus B games, jumping ahead of teams in front of them right now who have above five hundred records. Two of these teams happen to be SOU who only has one B opponent loss and my own team who beat Irvine and is 7-1 in B play. Just my own two cents.

[btriley01]

I'm going to be brave and say I am in agreement with scooter. You all are making a huge fuss with the RMLC-B and Montana, when they have yet to play anyone besides themselves. You can't really compare them with st. johns, st thomas, dayton, emory, and harding. They haven't played anyone over in the east. Now you can make the argument that the west is better than the east, but i'll could just as well argue the opposite. this is how i see it:

1. St. thomas
2. St. johns
3. Westminster
4. UVSC
5. Dayton
6. Harding
7. Montana State
8. Montana
9. Emory
10. UNC

A lot will be figured out in the next few weeks, But i will not be convinced that the RMLC and PNCLL can whip up on the rest of the B division until I see them do it. I cannot wait to be with you all at nationals. Its gonna be pimp.

[Brew26]

riley,
nobody is saying that the rmlc and pncll can whip up on anybody. Those leagues have a bunch of teams in the top15 that just played each other to close games. Why would they have st. johns and st. thomas ahead of them? It is just hard to rank the rmlc and pncll with Dayton and harding who i feel could run with those teams but wont know for sure till nationals. The only game to base the leagues together right now is st. johns vs UNC but like last year, people said the beginning of the season doesnt count for much. It will be the games in the next couple of weeks that matter.

[Kyle Berggren]

btriley01, that's where we disagree...

UNC 3 SJU 6

A score like this can mean a lot of things about team's strengths & it was the first game of the season, but we know that UNC is most likely competitive with SJU & the UMLL teams. SJU & STU are obviously pretty big rivals, & their most recent games have been close. From the sounds of it, both teams are up talent wise this year.... We have #1 votes for each team, I'll assume either team can win on any given day, we'll find out who wins round one shortly.

To place UNC amongst the other teams more easily, here are some other key losses for them...

UNC 7 UVSC 10
UNC 12 West. 20

It looks like they had a big break down against Westminster, but are at least competitive with UVSC... A 3 goal game, just like their game against SJU... That's probably the easiest example of how I have started to compare conferences... Forget the Team A beat B beat C that is going on in the RMLC... They've got at least 5 contenders for their crown. If UNC (in the middle of that 5 RMLC team pack) can play with SJU (& therefore STU), I'd say the RMLC is pretty tough... & has several deserving candidates for the upper end of the poll.

Some other important scores to note... Which help us compare the conferences.

STU 14 Harding 7
STU 11 Calvin 5
Harding +2 over Calvin

...an extra score...

Calvin +2 over PLU

Calvin & Harding are somewhere near each other in strength, & quite frankly, to have Harding at 6 is difficult for me to swallow. They lost by 7 to the number 1 team. A non-consensus 1, it seems to be any of those top 3 right now, I wish I could see the STU vs. SJU game that's coming up shortly.

Now if Calvin & Harding are somewhat equal in strength, I'd assume they fall somewhere near each other in the poll, but you left out Calvin, where are they in your poll? Your team is only 5 spots away from a team that beat them by 7, but you beat Calvin by 2 & they're no where to be found?

You also didn't punish UVSC for their loss to a team you didn't rank (Fort Lewis) or even WWU... Hell, WWU beat PLU 18-9 with PLU at full strength. An injured PLU team travelled to Calvin to play a tight game... In my eyes, Harding, PLU, & Calvin have to be somewhere near ranked together. That would only enforce the idea that WWU would be somewhere in the top 10, as would Montana (beat WWU by 1).

I'm not trying to advocate for the PNCLL, but WWU beat your number 4 & didn't make your poll. They played your number 7 & 8 to 1 goal games, another team beat your #4 & played your #3 to a couple goal game, & they didn't make your poll. Obviously we have some parity here, but you placed your own team @ 6, & I wouldn't say a 14-7 loss would make them as competitive as many of the other teams we're talking about... ? Would you?

Making a poll is a lot of hard work, & with all the team a beats b beats c beats a this year, it's as hard as it's ever been. The facts still remain, banning a few teams, arguing the Eastern teams are better than the West is going to be difficult. The RMLC is clearly the toughest division right now, the UMLL might have the 2 best teams in the MCLA B, the PNCLL has at least 2 teams that can compete with those tough RMLC teams, no one else has proven they can compete with those teams. The SELC, the CCLA, & the PCLL are the biggest questions for me as of now.

I hope you guys just take this as some food for thought, I'm not trying to attack you for your opinion. I hope you will present the other side of the argument, I know I, & I'm sure many other pollsters would love to see it. The more information we have the better, this was just my take on the situation.

[bjlaxman16]

Just to clarify Kyle, St Thomas is UST, not STU.

And I don't believe the St John's win over San Diego last year carried much weight throughout the season because it was such an early game. So I wouldn't expect the UNC-SJU game to be looked at too closely either.

[Kyle Berggren]

Thank you for the clarification, I'm so used to just writing ST, I didn't even think twice about it.

[AflacLax]

I'm not going to lie...I'm just hopeful to see the Colorado School of Mines logo on the poll. It's been a long time coming since a freshman year of 0-7, sophomore year of 3-9, junior at 6-6, and now to be 6-4 with at least 4 games remaining...

[bjlaxman16]

I'm not going to lie...I'm just hopeful to see the Colorado School of Mines logo on the poll. It's been a long time coming since a freshman year of 0-7, sophomore year of 3-9, junior at 6-6, and now to be 6-4 with at least 4 games remaining...

St. John's was in a similar situation only a few years ago:
2002 1-12
2003 5-11
Since 42-6 (including this season)

It's nice to see when teams improve so quickly! Good luck to you guys the rest of the season!!

[Dr. Jason Stockton]

I'm not going to lie...I'm just hopeful to see the Colorado School of Mines logo on the poll. It's been a long time coming since a freshman year of 0-7, sophomore year of 3-9, junior at 6-6, and now to be 6-4 with at least 4 games remaining...

You made my poll. The RMLC is brutally tough, and you guys have really played well. Good luck the rest of the way.