All Conference...continued

[Peter Lewicki]

...not to throw more fuel on the fire (which apparently led to the other thread being locked). But up until today this was a pretty decent discussion.

Granted, I have not seen the 3 Oregon players who have been mentioned, but I had the chance to see Eli Sonkin play this weekend in Spokane. He is clearly a catalyst to the UW offense. When he possessed the ball the other Husky players were set in motion. Eli, congrats on your season...I hope you are given serious consideration for Player of the Year. Your tremendous season and the UW's great season are related.

[Kyle Berggren]

What about Kladis? Does he get Coach of the Year considerations? MVP, Offensive MVP?

The guy obviously makes everyone on the field playing with him better. I completely forgot about the guy earlier, but who is more valuable to their team? Who else makes their teammates that much better? He's only averaging over 5ppg, and its only his 4th year doing it... I know his team is 6-5 overall (2-3 Division), but he needs some serious consideration as well.

[muchachojones]

B division MVP is another difficult argument with Sadler, Hall, and Brennan all racking up huge numbers offensively this season. One could also make an argument for several other players in the league.

[Another Dumb Jock]

We are 1.

People are forgetting the team mentality. Without the 9 other players on the field the individual becomes nothing. It's sad that only one player must be chosen to receive the MVP, A or B. Where is the Mr. Congeniality vote?
Since points are not the only representation of what a player does on the field, what should voters decide upon? We enter the realm of impossibility. All the players that have been mentioned, as well as every other member of the PNCLL, battle for their TEAM every time they step on the field. No one needs to be MVP. The second you desire outstanding recognition from your team, is the second you have given up its possibility. There is no I in team.
Thus the argument itself is silly. Who cares who the best playing in the league is, if there is no way to determine who that player is in the first. Lacrosse simply has too many aspects, and separating them out to determine superiority takes away from the game.
The only recognition that really matters is the LEAGUE CHAMPIONSHIP that one shares with the TEAM.

Wow, that sounds way too sentimental, buts that’s my two cents.

[TheNino57]

If a player on my team was awarded League MVP, I would be proud of him and would feel like I was a piece of that success. That player (since it can only be one) represents his whole team. This success should be recognized. Not every team has the opportunity to experience a league championship. All good teams have a great player who makes the players around him even better, that is why the teammates of the Coffmans, the Sonkins, and the Kladis' should consider themselves lucky to be apart of that environment. I would give my right arm to experience the kind of success with my teammates that Oregon has been enjoying as of late.

Moving on...
Has anyone given any thought to nominating Alex Johnson, goalie for Linfield, as a possible candidate to winning B Conferance Player of the Year? If you haven't played against Linfield, (not to sound like I'm knocking the Linfield Longpoles) Johnson makes this defense happen. It's harder than heck to get one past that guy and I feel he is a big reason why Linfield is one of the top teams in the league this season.

[laxloco]

seems like you wouldnt have to give up any limbs, just tuition to a different school

[Dan Wishengrad]

Jeremy and others makes some excellent points above that most of us will likely agree with. However, we all voted that we would hand out these awards so it is appropriate that we have this discussion. Hopefully everybody can make their case -- myself included -- without having to "bash" anybody else in the process. Personally I think it is great that so many of you get on here to nominate a player for an award and then make a case why this guy deserves it. It doesn't really matter whether this player is a teammate or an opponent. It's all good, as long as it's a positive endorsement of one player and not based on a negative things about another.

The process the Board uses to select the all-stars and the award winners starts with tallying the all-star votes each team casts on pncll.com after a game is played. If a team hasn't filed it's stats and game report, they have not cast their all-star votes either. If this applies to you PLEASE get caught up ASAP this week and cast those votes for your opponents! The rule has been if you don't bother casting all-star votes for your opponents then your own team gets no all-stars named. Anyway, our past MVP award winners have all been guys who got the most votes at their respective positions. It's not so much that we Board members select these guys for individual recognition, but that YOU folks do by casting all-star votes for them. I remember two years ago when we named Neil Butterfield the Offensive MVP there were howls of protest on the message boards by those who supported other candidates like Ricky Clark instead. But Neil had the most votes cast of any PNCLL player that year, if I remember correctly. This may not be a perfect sytem -- and no system CAN be perfect, but it seems fair overall, in my humble opinion anyway.

This year's MVP awards are going to be very tough to pick I believe. There's more parity in the league among teams and "top gun" star players. Just picking the three first-team all-star attackmen in the A division is going to be a very difficult choice between Christians, Kladis, Sonkin or Tipton -- one of these guys will have to be second-team, for example. Same goes for Midfield -- you've got Coffman, Gares, Ernst, Meinard, Steinecker and Weitz to name just six great middies who have impressive offensive statistics. The toughest positions to select all-stars among are defensive players and specialists -- faceoff guys, defensive middies and long-stick middies. These guys just don't get as many votes as the guys who score goals, and this is where the Board tries to collectively make the correct decision between two different players who may have only one or two all-star votes. I will predict, however, that a certain A division Goalie has an excellent chance to win the Defensive MVP as every team that plays against him surely gives him an all-star vote.

We have six voting Board members, three each from the A (Josh, Marilyn and Me) and B (Bubba, Dave and Jason) divisions. We'll deliberate thoughtfully over the players and try to do our best to come up with great 2005 all-star teams for both divisions. Just remember that we are not doing so "out of thin air", that the votes cast by these player's opponents are a key component of our process.

[Kojima]

I remember two years ago when we named Neil Butterfield the Offensive MVP there were howls of protest on the message boards by those who supported other candidates like Ricky Clark instead.

Ricky won League MVP that year. Neil was Offensive MVP, and Mark Thompson was the PNCLL Final Four MVP -- Fair enough, all deserving. And yes, you could have made a case for others, but that's always gonna be the case... The all-star and mvp selection process is fine, in my opinion.

And in the end, who really cares?! Like the above poster, I think the only honor that really matters is the league title and a trip to nationals. Besides, these awards are based on the regular season. And to me, the regular season doesn't mean much -- other than making it to playoffs, and padding your national ranking -- if you can't produce come playoff time. So, well the pncll regular season awards are nice, I don't think there anything to cry about if you don't get one. We all know who the best players are in this league, and they shouldn't need a trophy to tell em they're good. They should be playing for something else... With that said, I can't believe i didn't get an individual award in 03! "There is no i in team, but there is one in win -- give me the rock

ps. to answer your question, what should voters decide upon -- it's an impact the player has on the game. I agree with you that individual awards don't mean much, it's a team game and win or lose, you do so as a team. But if we are gonna have individual awards, I think they should go to the players who have the biggest impact on the outcome of a game. I also think it needs to be clarified whether our MVPs are mvp's of their team, or the league/conference. i think there's a big difference between who is the best player in a league, and who is most valuable to their team.

[woulax4]

"Has anyone given any thought to nominating Alex Johnson, goalie for Linfield, as a possible candidate to winning B Conferance Player of the Year?"

I got the privlage of seeing this guy play twice this year and I agree 100% with that. Johnson has put up sick numbers this year and I would find it hard to believe that he wont receive defensive MVP if not more at the end of the season.

[Scrape Mode]

There's a good chance I'm wrong but weren't there only three offensive All Americans out of the PNCLL last season?! (they don't have the 2004 info on laxpower) In my opinion, along with the opinion of all those who vote on AA's, these 3 are the best offensive players in the league. Hands down. #11 #25 #50

[ZagGrad]

In my opinion, along with the opinion of all those who vote on AA's, these 3 are the best offensive players in the league. Hands down. #11 #25 #50

Biased? Naaahhh....

[Dr. Jason Stockton]

The MVP is not the guy who scores the most points. The Most Valuable Player is the guy who stirs the drink, so to speak. I think last year's MVP Danny Ernst is a perfect example of an MVP. He was the catalyst offensively AND defensively for the best team in the league. On the ground, man-to-man defense, face offs, big goals in big games, etc. Additionally, he was a class act on and off the field. When I cast my vote for league awards, conduct to me is a huge factor.

I do believe we have also given an award for FINALS MVP - essentially the key player for the team that goes to nationals. I don't know if we've given out that award recently (I remember Dylan Myers, the goalie from UW in 2002 winning it) - but I'd like to see that award given out as well.

It's OK to recognize individual achievement in a team game. It happens in every sport. Everyone understands that no one player wins or loses a lacrosse game on his own. . .but to reward outstanding play by an individual within the scope of a team game is a good idea, and any player winning one of these awards should be very proud.

[Kyle Berggren]

I'm pretty sure Nate Cordova recieved the Finals MVP last season, I could be wrong, but I agree Jason. If I were in your shoes, I would cast my vote the same way. I have my list of Division B players I won't share, but we'll see if I'm right in a few weeks, but A is a bit tougher, I think I may have it narrowed down to 5-6. Kind of makes me wish I was voting.

[Kojima]

Biased? Naaahhh....

Also, not true. ps. the PNCLL does award a pncll mvp award for the final four. thompson got it in 2003. and cordova was well deserving of it in 04. see the new poll question.

[Scrape Mode]

I can't help that my three picks happen to all play for the same team. Maybe that is a big reason as to why their team is performing at a higher level this year. If we were discussing the top players in the USLIA then my picks would look very different. I would have none of the three players I have previously mentioned and would have players from at least three different teams up there.