Under and Overrated teams?

[WaterBoy]

Thanks Will, that was exactly my point. You can't fault a team for trying to schedule aggressively and their opponents having down years.

I see the point. I think you're right. You can't fault their intentions. I don't think it would be reasonable to dispute that.

I think that the intentions to schedule should be a nonfactor in the polls though. This is splitting hairs, but I think it's an important distinction.

Did Lindenwood try to set up a tougher schedule than it turned out to be? Clearly they did.

Here's the important part though- it turned out that the teams that they had scheduled were not as good as previously believed. Then, of the two teams that managed to stay in the top 25, granted who they both beat, are ranked 19 and 22, with the number 22 taking them to a one goal game at home, and an unranked team taking them to overtime at home.

There are three issues here:

-Who did they TRY to play? - not really important- may yield sympathy, which isn't entirely undeserved (but also should be given to every other team that scheduled the same teams as they did, by that standard). Who they intended to play yields no information in terms of how good of a team they are.

-Who DID they play? - This is the question that needs to be asked. It shouldn't matter for beans what a team was ranked preseason. It should matter what an opponent is ranked (currently). Once again seeming a small distinction, but nonetheless an important one.

-How did they PERFORM- they only have one convincing win over a ranked team- and that's over Miami-OH, who's on their way down.

Just consider- is it reasonable that a team garners a ranking of 15, when they were taken to overtime at home by an unranked?

Overrated. Not saying they should be out of the polls. Just out of #15 for sure.

[cjwilhelmi]

You... gotta be kidding me. This argument just isn't going to hold water with me, nor should it with anyone else. If you use only the preseason rankings to determine how strong your schedule is, the polls would be DRASTICALLY different. There's a reason that EVERY SINGLE TEAM that Lindenwood scheduled dropped in the poll from preseason level. Of those five, three aren't ranked anymore. It's one of the risks that every team takes when scheduling out of conference.

Looks like your a psychic, who should Lindenwood scheduled? Keep in mind that last season they weren't ranked and that highly ranked teams only like to schedule ranked teams.

When the only OOC games scheduled are against one league, there is a risk of that league not having a good year

Wait, wait, wait. I do agree that maybe lulions had been off on his math or stated which poll he was using when they played those teams. But you are dead wrong here. You say they played OOC against one other conference (LSA). They played teams in the UMLL, LSA and CCLA. Last time I checked 1+1+1=3

Keep in mind that "my opinion" = "hill of beans"

Yeah that makes sense.


Oh and know that I am in no way affiliated with Lindenwood. I just thought that what you said wasn't stated in a way that truly showed the complete picture. Granted that the teams they have played are not ranked anymore except for one or two. But if you look at their schedule and imagine if you can that the date is January 1st 2005 and you will think to yourself "wow thats a good schedule for a team trying to make a name for themselves".

I'm done

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[TMcCourt]

Boston College went out to California with three practices in a gym and played four games in four days and won those games soundly. Granted, the team did not schedule Sonoma or UCSB but I think most people would agree that it would be very difficult to play either of those teams on zero days rest with very little practice time. The practice time thing is not meant as an excuse but because BC is in the city and the school does not hold club sports highly, the school will not give the team time in the bubble or on any of the fields in the area (tough situation all around). The teams spring break falls right as snow is melting around Boston (very early march) so it is tough to get anytime anywhere around Boston before the break.

The win over Chico after three straight games should at least show that BC can be competitive with most top teams in the USLIA. This post was not meant to pump BC up but rather defend the schedule that they have taken and hopefully the team can have a good showing in Blaine, Mn (assuming they make it).

[Dan Wishengrad]

I'm one of thirty and have been voting for LU. In my eyes they've done nothing to move up or down significantly from where I have them ranked.

That being said, we have a new headache this week, and that's ranking the SELC teams. FSU's big win over V-Tech has this voter confused where to rank these teams now. I had dropped the 'Noles big time after a shocking loss to an unranked team, now I'm not sure how high now to bump FSU back up. Same goes for V-Tech, they've got to drop in my rankings, but I'm not sure how many spots is fair. The other teams I vote for will be impacted by how I ultimately sort this SELC mess out.

I would like to read some opinions from SELC land before I cast my ballot!

[cjwilhelmi]

EDIT:

wow, a post just dissapeared on me... i'm losing my mind... didn't bluevelvet have a post right here?

[Ben Ingram]

WaterBoy keeping running your mouth, but I suggest you see the teams play that you are talking down, and say are over ranked.

First off Lindenwood from the sounds of it are not over ranked at all I have yet to see them this season but from everything I heard they are a very strong team with a lot of heart to back it up.

Oakland I have seen play several times over the past 3 seasons, and all I have to say about them is that they have a lot of fire power, and there defense is the best I have seen it yet, they have held I think 5 or 6 of the teams they have played to 6 goals or less. The UofM game will be their only chance to get the national recognition, I do agree with that however. But I also think the CCLA is an underated confrence also.

As far as saying teams are over ranked, that you have nothing to back it up, and all those teams are having great seasons up to this point.

[WaterBoy]

Please don't make the hasty mistake of thinking that I mean that these schools aren't having good seasons. They just, so far, haven't in my mind shown that they deserve the rankings that they're getting. It's a thread about who we think is overranked or underranked. I answered.

In terms of having nothing to back my claims up... what, in your mind, would make sufficient grounds for determining ranking aside from SOS, W/L and goal margins? Should the poll be based off of how many times you've seen each time play and how good they were two years ago?

Please, enlighten me to the wonder that is your rating system.

[Danny Hogan]

Boston College went out to California with three practices in a gym and played four games in four days. . .

i've seen this a few times. if they were practicing in a gym why did they only have three practices?

Not looking to challenge anyone, just clarify.

[Tim Gray]

Boston College went out to California with three practices in a gym and played four games in four days. . .

i've seen this a few times. if they were practicing in a gym why did they only have three practices?

Not looking to challenge anyone, just clarify.

While I don't know exactly what the situation with BC is, at NU, we must also share the gym with Varsity sports such as Baseball, Football, Track, Soccer, etc. We were lucky enough this year, that the school expanded the hours of our indoor space staying open until midnight, and we were able to get about 8-10 total practics in Jan and Feb, where as in the past we would get around 5. Also, going from practicing indoors in a confined amount of space with a very level/hard playing surface to going to a more open uneven playing field is a bit of an adjustment. My guess is that BC also has to fight for the scraps of available gym time that the varsity sports don't want with a few other club sports.

[BClax16]

BC's preseason practices were held a local high school (the team could not get time at any of the schools athletic facilites). As far as reasons for only 3 practices I would have to say that it is a mix of the high school's gym availibility and the cost of renting it out.

[new-WI-l-axplayer]

I can't really speak for A division, I've only seen what you guys say and a handful of A games. I watched Duluth handle unranked A teams like they were giving a clinic, and Lindenwood beating them didn't shock me on the sole fact that I've never seen Lindenwood play. I bet Duluth will climb back up, not saying that they are underranked, but they'll move up. Illinois sounds like a good team, but they just don't seem to win. They play good games against good unranked teams or lower ranked teams.

As far as the "B" division goes, St. Thomas is underrated. They beat # 21 Dordt and S. Dakota, a team that has a higher point total in the voting.

Also, why would St. John's drop in ranking from #2, to #5? We've played both Calvin and St. Johns's this year, and St. John's seems to me the better team. Both Great, but by record, they should definatly be on top. Also, someone had rankings all the way up to 100 or something. Where is that from?

[Danny Hogan]

Please don't make the hasty mistake of thinking that I mean that these schools aren't having good seasons. They just, so far, haven't in my mind shown that they deserve the rankings that they're getting.

Who do you think should occupy that spot instead?

[Pinball]

Also, someone had rankings all the way up to 100 or something. Where is that from?

http://www.LaxPower.com. But it isnt very reliable for rankings considering it is just computer rankings.

[benji]

A number of replies to this thread have referenced a team's practice facilities.

Why should a team's practice facilities have ANYTHING to do with this? I thought the question at hand was which teams were under/overrated? I mean, if a team plays like a below .500 team (hypothetical example), why should it matter whether or not the aforementioned team has adequate practice facilities? ... they're still performing poorly, and therefore, should be ranked accordingly.

I don't believe pity is a factor when the ballots are submitted.

Also, and I hate to admit this, but I think Oakland and Lindenwood are ranked appropriately. We've faced both of these teams so far this season, and both times I've had my doubts, but these teams have brought the performance to back the hype. I thought TTU was underranked until the both of these teams had convincing wins over us.

[Daniel Morris]

A number of replies to this thread have referenced a team's practice facilities.

Why should a team's practice facilities have ANYTHING to do with this? I thought the question at hand was which teams were under/overrated? I mean, if a team plays like a below .500 team (hypothetical example), why should it matter whether or not the aforementioned team has adequate practice facilities? ... they're still performing poorly, and therefore, should be ranked accordingly.

Practice time before the season gets going does play a part in determining who is under/overrated. Some teams suffer early losses because they are just getting on the field when others have played six or so games. One example is Northeastern. I think they have a great team this year, but in their second game and probably only 4th outdoor outing/6th practice overall, played a very strong Florida State that already had 5 games and numerous practices. Northeastern is just now getting into their season and have started to steamroll teams, having one of the country's top scorers.

Until the last few weeks when everyone is playing in adequate outdoor conditions with a good portion of their schedule behind them, it is hard to determine who has a good team that just needed some playing time together and who has a team where it wouldn't matter if they practiced all year long. Some of the Northern and Northeastern programs have been waiting for the opportunity to show they have great teams, but at this point in the season, it becomes tough to crack into the Top 25. Thus, they end up as underated programs flying under the radar until playoffs.