The PNCLL at the 2008 MCLA National Championships in Dallas

[Thrilla]

other than this year...

Does anyone know the last time a team went from being in the national championship game to not even making the tourney the next year?

Ravaging Beast posted it in another forum I think, but he said something along the lines that since it has gone to a 16 team tourney this is the first time it has happened.

As you can imagine a lot of my time recently has been spent thinking about lacrosse and I found this following information pretty interesting, it might be interesting for everyone else considering the amount of mystery surrounding the Oregon Program and the carry over of players from the 2007 season. An injury denotes an injury ending one's 2008 season

2007 Playoff Roster
#
1. Patrick McMurdo
2. Paul Swanson
3. Kyle Tolzman- Graduated
4. Brett Retallick- INJ Knee
5. Andrew Vincent
6. Brett Whyte
7. Ryan Craven-Graduated
8. Cole Magnuson
9. Josh Schane
10. Erik Lynies- INJ Shoulder
11. Ben Kopca
12. Jeff Brunell
13. Jon Jardim
14. Trevor Tesar- Graduated
15. Jon Matiefesky- INJ Collar Bone
16. Kevin Bozada- Quit
17. Austin Loranger
18. Daichi- Graduated
19. Nick Riely- Transfered
20. Ryan Warren- Graduated
21. Ben Harvey- Quit
22. Clay Knope- Quit
23. Justin Blackmore
24. Todd Jolly- Graduated
25. Julian Coffman- Graduated
26. Kevin Jewitt- Quit
27. Scott Miller- Graduated
28. Cody Aldrich- Quit
29. Andrew Clough- Became Coach
30. James Tarlow- Quit
31. Miles Makdesi- INJ Knee
33. Tim Bates- Quit
35. Ben Finger- Quit
39. Alex Guevara
40. Will DeSiervo
41. Chad Loesher
42. Alex Johnson- Grauated
43. Bo Montage- Quit
62. Darrin Loesher- INJ- Back


Coaches
Joe Kerwin- Left for NDNU
Erik Hewitt- Left the team
Tal- Left for Ohio State
Tiller- Head coach for majority of 2008 season


I should really get back to studying for this midterm.

[timekeeper]

I'm predicting an SFU - Michigan - Chapman - ASU final four.

Do any teams from the south or east have a strong shot at being in the final four?

Best team east of the rockies is Duluth, i think they have a good shot at the Final Four this year

Best team east of the Rockies is Michigan. It beat Duluth this year, as it beat 7 other ranked teams (including 6 on the road) in going 14-0 this season. I don't think any other D1 team won as many games against ranked teams and I know of no other team that beat BYU at BYU, Arizona State at Arizona State, Colorado State at Colorado State, Duluth at Duluth, Colorado at Colorado and Michigan State on a neutral field. It also beat Arizona at Arizona, Illinois and Lindenwood at Michigan and Michigan State again in their tournament championship game. How could anyone think that another team could be better than that?

sorry i forgot about michigan, with the way the played this year they are the favorite.

It IS Michigan though... it's as if the lacrosse Gods hate them when it comes National Championship time. I don't see them making the finals, and maybe not even the final four.

Me either, I mean for their sake I hope they do, but they just always fold like a cheap lawn chair at the tourney

Yes, Michigan hasn't won the National Championship yet but it's hardly accurate to say they've folded like a cheap lawn chair (or even a cheap long chair). Past losses in the tournament have come to UCSB, Colorado State and BYU (multiple times). That's hardly underachieving.

[Ballaholic]

I'm predicting an SFU - Michigan - Chapman - ASU final four.

Do any teams from the south or east have a strong shot at being in the final four?

Best team east of the rockies is Duluth, i think they have a good shot at the Final Four this year

Best team east of the Rockies is Michigan. It beat Duluth this year, as it beat 7 other ranked teams (including 6 on the road) in going 14-0 this season. I don't think any other D1 team won as many games against ranked teams and I know of no other team that beat BYU at BYU, Arizona State at Arizona State, Colorado State at Colorado State, Duluth at Duluth, Colorado at Colorado and Michigan State on a neutral field. It also beat Arizona at Arizona, Illinois and Lindenwood at Michigan and Michigan State again in their tournament championship game. How could anyone think that another team could be better than that?

sorry i forgot about michigan, with the way the played this year they are the favorite.

It IS Michigan though... it's as if the lacrosse Gods hate them when it comes National Championship time. I don't see them making the finals, and maybe not even the final four.

They have struggled in the past. I think they are like Oregon last year. Amazing FOGO specialist with very solid players up and down the field.

[nhoskins]

other than this year...

Does anyone know the last time a team went from being in the national championship game to not even making the tourney the next year?

Ravaging Beast posted it in another forum I think, but he said something along the lines that since it has gone to a 16 team tourney this is the first time it has happened.

As you can imagine a lot of my time recently has been spent thinking about lacrosse and I found this following information pretty interesting, it might be interesting for everyone else considering the amount of mystery surrounding the Oregon Program and the carry over of players from the 2007 season. An injury denotes an injury ending one's 2008 season

2007 Playoff Roster
#
1. Patrick McMurdo
2. Paul Swanson
3. Kyle Tolzman- Graduated
4. Brett Retallick- INJ Knee
5. Andrew Vincent
6. Brett Whyte
7. Ryan Craven-Graduated
8. Cole Magnuson
9. Josh Schane
10. Erik Lynies- INJ Shoulder
11. Ben Kopca
12. Jeff Brunell
13. Jon Jardim
14. Trevor Tesar- Graduated
15. Jon Matiefesky- INJ Collar Bone
16. Kevin Bozada- Quit
17. Austin Loranger
18. Daichi- Graduated
19. Nick Riely- Transfered
20. Ryan Warren- Graduated
21. Ben Harvey- Quit
22. Clay Knope- Quit
23. Justin Blackmore
24. Todd Jolly- Graduated
25. Julian Coffman- Graduated
26. Kevin Jewitt- Quit
27. Scott Miller- Graduated
28. Cody Aldrich- Quit
29. Andrew Clough- Became Coach
30. James Tarlow- Quit
31. Miles Makdesi- INJ Knee
33. Tim Bates- Quit
35. Ben Finger- Quit
39. Alex Guevara
40. Will DeSiervo
41. Chad Loesher
42. Alex Johnson- Grauated
43. Bo Montage- Quit
62. Darrin Loesher- INJ- Back


Coaches
Joe Kerwin- Left for NDNU
Erik Hewitt- Left the team
Tal- Left for Ohio State
Tiller- Head coach for majority of 2008 season


I should really get back to studying for this midterm.

What's with all the quitters?

[slowbreak]

Nope. With the exception of FSU making the final four one year, the eastern and southern teams aren't even in the conversation.

Okay, I know this is all speculation...but I am curious how Florida and Georgia would do if they played in the PNCLL , RMLC, or WCLL. Same question about B.C. and Texas AM -- would these southern/east coast teams beat the Huskies? Would Montana and Colorado be comparable to them?

Some of you with more experience in watching the national tournament and being familiar with our part of the country should be able to answer this one. Thanks.

[nhoskins]

Nope. With the exception of FSU making the final four one year, the eastern and southern teams aren't even in the conversation.

Okay, I know this is all speculation...but I am curious how Florida and Georgia would do if they played in the PNCLL , RMLC, or WCLL. Same question about B.C. and Texas AM -- would these southern/east coast teams beat the Huskies? Would Montana and Colorado be comparable to them?

Some of you with more experience in watching the national tournament and being familiar with our part of the country should be able to answer this one. Thanks.

I think Florida and Georgia would be competitive in the PNCLL, and probably be lumped in with 3-6 teams that seem to fluctuate between making playoffs and not each year. UO and SFU would still be head and shoulders above them.

In the WCLL, it depends on the conference in terms of playoffs. But overall, I'd say Florida and Georgia would find themselves 5-8 overall in the WCLL on a yearly basis. I'd put Sonoma, UCSB, ASU, Chapman, and whoever the WCLL flavor of the year is above them. Now, before an SELC fan jumps all over me, I'd pick UCSB to beat Florida/FSU 9 games out of 10... guess this year was that 1/10 time.

Comparable to Colorado and Montana? I'd say so.

[ZagGrad]

What's with all the quitters?

Did they actually quit or transfer to play somewhere else?

[OAKS]

I think Florida and Georgia would be competitive in the PNCLL, and probably be lumped in with 3-6 teams that seem to fluctuate between making playoffs and not each year. UO and SFU would still be head and shoulders above them.

Georgia has only come back onto the ranked scene in the past 2 or 3 years, but Florida has been around the top 20 6 out of the last 8 years and has broken into the top 10 a couple of times.

I think while UO and SFU have had some really good teams over the years and might be "head and shoulders above them" once in a while, UF would still be competitive in the long term, making almost all of the conference tournaments and fighting for and winning conference championships every few years.

[Kyle Berggren]

Georgia looked really good in Dallas last year... I would have expected them to in the very least play with the '07 Clan... This year, I don't know what they've got, but that team was talented & it turned me around on thinking the SELC was all show. That was a very talented team, very athletic, with some fantastic shooters... If they haven't lost much from last year, they'll still be very competitive in Dallas this year. I would put them a cut above Montana (as I wear my Griz hat) & the Huskies.

[Highheat]

I'm predicting an SFU - Michigan - Chapman - ASU final four.

Do any teams from the south or east have a strong shot at being in the final four?

I would quite frankley be SHOCKED if there were no RMLC team in the Final Four. CSU or BYU will make it, more likely it will be the latter...

[Dr. Jason Stockton]

I would quite frankley be SHOCKED if there were no RMLC team in the Final Four. CSU or BYU will make it, more likely it will be the latter...

For those historians out there. . .when was the last final four that didn't include an RMLC team? Has there ever been a final four without a WCLL team? I'd certainly doubt it. . .

[Timbalaned]

I think Florida and Georgia would be competitive in the PNCLL, and probably be lumped in with 3-6 teams that seem to fluctuate between making playoffs and not each year. UO and SFU would still be head and shoulders above them.

Georgia has only come back onto the ranked scene in the past 2 or 3 years, but Florida has been around the top 20 6 out of the last 8 years and has broken into the top 10 a couple of times.

I think while UO and SFU have had some really good teams over the years and might be "head and shoulders above them" once in a while, UF would still be competitive in the long term, making almost all of the conference tournaments and fighting for and winning conference championships every few years.

Agree. I think the addition of two teams like UF and UGA would be sweet. Not that it would ever happen, but they would bring a lot more competition into the league. I don't know if they would have ever won league with the teams the UO and SFU have put out recently, but there would have been a lot more fun games to watch and play.

[Timbalaned]

What's with all the quitters?

Did they actually quit or transfer to play somewhere else?

Yeah Quit is a very bold statement for a lot of those kids. Some transfered to other schools like Cody "Sunshine" Aldrich, I know of at least one that had to go to Lane CC cause their grades weren't up and other's parents said no more lacrosse, you need to study cause your grades suck. And I know some had some other personal issues with stuff going on. So quitting is a very bold statement and could be described a lot more for most of those guys.

[Thrilla]

What's with all the quitters?

Did they actually quit or transfer to play somewhere else?

Yeah Quit is a very bold statement for a lot of those kids. Some transfered to other schools like Cody "Sunshine" Aldrich, I know of at least one that had to go to Lane CC cause their grades weren't up and other's parents said no more lacrosse, you need to study cause your grades suck. And I know some had some other personal issues with stuff going on. So quitting is a very bold statement and could be described a lot more for most of those guys.

I stand by my quit statement. Cody is the exception as he more "retired" than quit. The rest of the guys had personal reasons and I see them nearly everyday on campus. As I am sure for most club teams, its a big commitment and a big price tag, and the opportunity cost of losing out on so many weekends is too much for most guys. I really don't blame them, you really gotta love this game to play at such a high level for a club. I am surprised most teams don't have this kind of turnover. My freshmen year I considered quitting everyday, you just really gotta love it.


or maybe its just practicing in the rain.

[TheBearcatHimself]

I stand by my quit statement. Cody is the exception as he more "retired" than quit. The rest of the guys had personal reasons and I see them nearly everyday on campus. As I am sure for most club teams, its a big commitment and a big price tag, and the opportunity cost of losing out on so many weekends is too much for most guys. I really don't blame them, you really gotta love this game to play at such a high level for a club. I am surprised most teams don't have this kind of turnover. My freshmen year I considered quitting everyday, you just really gotta love it.


or maybe its just practicing in the rain.

I have to agree with Thrilla on the "quit" wording, my inside source told me that "quitting" had become rampant. I'm not gonna throw out reasons because they were off the record, but there were conflicts that influenced the decisions to leave the team.

I also am in agreement on the fact that it is surprising less teams experience this amount of turnover. Playing for a club sport is a very interesting beast. Instead of a varsity sport where the U throws money at you, you have to throw more money back at the club just to be on the team and then you don't even get any of the respect varsity athletes do, despite the fact that you are an elite player in your respective sport just like the varsity athletes. I know at my school they throw banquets for the sports that no one ever watches: cross country, crew, golf, and swimming, but we don't get squat. It's a tough sell to tell a potential player that he can spill his heart and soul out on the field and get nothing in return from the university.

But this has been said before...thought I'd just repeat it. It is shocking more teams don't experience this turnover. Maybe it is the rain.