Div A Subdivisions

[beckner11]

I'm completely against the EB making any decisions on their own anymore. I feel that there MUST be outside discussion and say in the decision!

The one problem that I've thought of has begun to be addressed, the playoff issue. As with this year, my team was the #4 seed. If we stick with 4 teams in the playoffs next year then we would be on the outside of playoffs with a AA team in. I would then be completely against this because I felt we deserved to be in the playoffs and wouldn't want to be "snubbed" just due to the fact that they were able to defeat some teams who are still developing (not trying to put down any teams with that comment!). I'd say a 6 team playoff with it being 4 A and 2 AA.
Do we know anything about Newman and Pitt State trying to join the league again this year? Any other new teams petitioning for acceptance that may fit in with the new system?

[A.J. Stevens]

I'm completely against the EB making any decisions on their own anymore. I feel that there MUST be outside discussion and say in the decision!

No decision has been made. A proposal/motion will be made to the EB. If they approve it then the A teams must approve or reject the motion.

[NELAX21]

Do we know anything about Newman and Pitt State trying to join the league again this year? Any other new teams petitioning for acceptance that may fit in with the new system?

I have been told that the Newman team has been dropped at the university so they will not be trying to get in any conference. which is a shame because they had a very talented team last year that could have been really good this year in B.

[Sonny]

I'm completely against the EB making any decisions on their own anymore. I feel that there MUST be outside discussion and say in the decision!

Good luck finding neutral parties to serve on your conference EB if they hold no power and are paid relatively no $$ for services rendered.

The fact of the matter is that most organizations like sports conferences are run by an smaller board of executives (day to day operations, setting meeting agendas, etc.) and the membership approves/denies motions. This is especially important at our self funded level of play where you would need 25+ votes to move the agenda of a conference forward.

That's not to say that there can't be any "discussion." But you should be talking with your representation (i.e. EB) as needed now.

Your conference needs to elect appropriate/qualified representatives to the EB and let them go to work for the betterment of the conference. If they don't do the job, you can nominate an alternate person at the end of their term.

[Matt_Gardiner]

Our Commissioner Brian Mosher is extremely neutral. He has a very old connection to U of I, but it does not weigh on his decisions. I believe that Beckner was objecting more to major decisions being made quickly by the EB. A decision had to be made quickly on the Missouri / Missouri State issue and a seeding had to be placed. I am guessing that Andrew's feelings are still hurt by what he sees as an unfair decision (I inclined to agree, but I do not have near all the facts).

Our system is, what our system is. If you do not like the EB or the EB's decisions the most important thing is to get people you trust and people you believe will fight for the right decisions elected. On that level, I can not express how happy I have been with Will Gilner who consistently has done what is right for the conference as a whole without consideration for Creighton. I firmly believe there are other quality guys around the league that would do the same in the B division. Mike Martin and Ethan Ritz are just two people who are committed to the conference and would make fair decisions. The problem for the A division is teams seem to be running out of established coaches. Wash U, Kansas, and Missouri all lost their coaches. I am curious to see how this effects things.

Not that I want to vote on the A / AA decision, but when did the B division get cut out of the ability to vote on issues that could have a residual effect on them.

[A.J. Stevens]

Not that I want to vote on the A / AA decision, but when did the B division get cut out of the ability to vote all together.

In the two years I have been in the GRLC the A & B divisions have voted independently when it is an issue that effects only A or B. Why would either division vote on an issue that has little or nothing to do with them? Also I would have no problem with someone else running for my position on the EB. It generally involves much criticism and little thanks. Whenever we have to make a decision, someone will always piss and moan about how they were cheated. I do not believe I have done anything in my time on the EB that has given Illinois an unfair advantage over other teams.

[essn1064]

(this is a reply from past message)
1. Oxford Ms... is not the furthest possible location for a team in the GRLC... Ole Miss traveled to Springfield MO, no problem...why cant the Missouri state team return the favor? But it is far from Illinois, Kansas, and Nebraska(that I understand)
2. A developmental division has its merits, but does not foster better competition. By playing better teams is the only true way to develop a team. Granted a blow out is not fun, but a necessity for strengthening team bonds.
3. I am use to the organization of the WCLL....will Harding move up to div A....?

[arlaxpdt]

The idea is not terrible. What most are worried about is valid, in that since all teams pay dues to the organization, they do not want to be disenfranchised from the ability for post season recognition and playoffs. If the proposal were to include provisions (as have been thrown about in earlier posts) that AA teams would be able to compete in playoffs under certain circumstances, it meets the intent of both trying to improve teams and allow equal chances for all teams paying dues to the orginization. In this event, KSU would be in favor of a 6 game, 4A, 2AA split in playoffs, understanding the St Louis is central for logistical purposes.

[scooter]

3. I am use to the organization of the WCLL....will Harding move up to div A....?

I highly doubt they would want to, nor should they be forced too. Just because a team is good in the B division doesn't mean they should be forced to play A ball. The B division is for smaller schools who can't draw the talent or number of players that the A division can. No need to put them on the same scale

Also, I'm willing to bet they are losing a few key players this year, so it will be interesting to see how they fare next year in the B division.

[A.J. Stevens]

At no point in this thread has it been proposed to have the top B team move up to A. Let's not start that conversation again.

[FeartheFlow]

When teams get blown out, it just sort of kills their spirit and makes them realize where they are and for a lot of kids who are trying to enjoy college it makes them question, "if it is worth it?"

Having teams play other teams where everyone is able to beat everyone will give those teams a reason to play, and a desire to win, because it is very realistic. In turn, the teams will become more organized, more committed, and just better.

When they do succeed, they will be able to look at what they just did as a formula for success, and it will be an "honor" be in the regular division A, knowing they won't necc. get to stay in it, giving them motivation to prove people wrong.

I think the positives definitely outweight the negatives for this "AA" division. It would be unfair to the B teams to have such large schools in B, but it is unfair for these programs that are not as developed (often because they have no in-state high school lacrosse, which makes it hard to compete when most kids go to the instate college) to have to try to compete with them until they are ready.

[DRich17]

I'm completely against the EB making any decisions on their own anymore. I feel that there MUST be outside discussion and say in the decision!

Before I remark to this, who is on the executive board?

[Michael Martin]

The GRLC Executive Board membership is:
Brian Mosher – Commissioner
AJ Stevens – A Division Director
Will Gilner – B Division Director
Corbin Wilhelmi – Treasurer
Michael Martin – Secretary
Troy Hood – At-large Member

Sorry for the delay, I overlooked this before the holidays.

[Zeuslax]

When teams get blown out, it just sort of kills their spirit and makes them realize where they are and for a lot of kids who are trying to enjoy college it makes them question, "if it is worth it?"

Having teams play other teams where everyone is able to beat everyone will give those teams a reason to play, and a desire to win, because it is very realistic. In turn, the teams will become more organized, more committed, and just better.

I look at this in a completely different light and with a different approach. Teams that are struggling, possibly just floundering and newer programs use these games and experiences as stimulus. They create motivation for on-the-field and off-the-field improvement/success. They look at better programs and aspire for a different level, with a greater understanding of what it takes to be successful. This is not always from an off-the-field perspective either. It isn't any secret that off-the-field organization is directly tied to wins and loses. I’m not talking about MI or BYU level of organization either.

Many of the MCLA teams made the decision to be competitive by observing their peers. They made the simple observation of "what does it take or what will it take", with a collective decision to improve and with a vision that includes patience. Usually this starts with the team acquiring a dedicated adult to run the show. Quite frankly, I think the outlined scenario has been and will continue to be the primary reason for the huge success of the MCLA.

A team and building a sustainable organization (not a house of cards built on one person like we see too often) takes time. Instant satisfaction usually isn't the case, especially in some conferences (IE RMLC DI). We could create a hypothetical list with at least 50 names (maybe more) of coaches and admin's across the MCLA. Select any one, drop them off in the worst town and with the worst team and I guarantee a fairly quick turn around. I’m not saying that some teams don’t need or deserve some assistance. Often some time and guidance is needed. To more directly address your comment, it’s been my experience that you get better by playing against better competition. It's easy to understand where consistent blow outs aren’t fun or productive for anyone. Maybe some of the teams that need “lower level” scheduling assistance aren’t ready for the MCLA? Maybe they should be placed on a prescriptive path, with guidance and oversight outside of the league and conference until they’re ready? I'm not sure. I haven’t formed an opinion on the issue as I can see both sides of the debate.

[A.J. Stevens]

To more directly address your comment, it’s been my experience that you get better by playing against better competition.

With that said would it also result in more talented teams getting worse by playing in these "blowouts"? In the GRLC do we freeze the developmental opportunities of our better teams by requiring more games in the conference that will result in lopsided scores. Or do we free them up a few extra weeks to continue to play the top national teams and inturn raising the bar in the GRLC? I believe the entire conference gains more by catering to the highest level of competition rather than the lowest. Just my 2 cents..