Sean Taylor passes away at 24

[LaxRef]

It is a dangerous idea that men can live in peace...

Maybe they can't. But if they don't have guns, a lot of would-be shootings turn into black eyes instead.

[BucLax13]

Banning guns does not rid the world of guns... insert drug war and prohibition info here

criminals already have a good corners on certain markets let's try not to give them other sources of revenue


hey I am totally down for universal conscription!

how many of those hand gun murders where commited with registered guns?

who the hell would break into a house knowing that every individual in the country had an automatic rifle with ammunition?

"laws that forbid the carrying of arms . . . disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes . . . Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." Cesare Beccaria

and ref no, the fights won't end in black eyes, it will end in you getting shot because the government took away your right to own a gun... hence what I see in this case

[BucLax13]

ref I like what you are saying, it still doesn't take into consideration that you are only punishing/disarming those that obey the law and not those who are breaking it

[LaxRef]

ref I like what you are saying, it still doesn't take into consideration that you are only punishing/disarming those that obey the law and not those who are breaking it

Well, a few things here. One, it may be too late for us here because there are already so many guns. But in those countries where you can't get guns easily, if at all, the homicide rates are waaaay lower than here, so apparently they do a good job of keeping guns out of everyone's hands.

Second, I don't understand why so many people buy the slippery-slope argument that if you ban assault rifles, fully-automatic weapons, and hollow-point bullets that you won't be able to protect yourself in your home anymore. I think the framers might have tightened up their wording a little bit if they envisioned the kind of crimes these high-powered weapons are being used for.

Finally, I feel many people think a high percentage of the murders committed in this country "don't count" because they happen in bad parts of the inner city and not so much in the nice suburbs.

[BucLax13]

I am not talking about assault rifles or hollow tip bullets... the argument for me falls at hand guns

maybe the framers would have said that everyone should be able to keep equal technologies though... including hollows and semi-automatic rifles

think about it... the reason they amended keeping a militia <-- not guns) was that the country could protect themselves from foreign and domestic infractions of liberty <--including our own government) england bent settlers guns around trees to stop them from being able to defend themselves, if semi-auto where the norm don't you think they would have protected their ownership at that time

(remember though I don't necessarily agree with this, and when I think about it I typically err the opposite assumptions on numerous (2) issues)

[KnoxVegas]

I don't have a dog in the is fight either way. I expressed my condolences and opened the door for further discussion on gun control. I never stated my thoughts either way.

[James Foote]

Also, the name of this thread is misleading, this was murder in the 1st degree, plain and simple. There was no gentle passing, no euphemism can console the pain that this crime has caused. I apologize to whoever created this thread, I just find the word choice upsetting.

Forgive me for my word choice. Yes, 1st degree murder... but he passed away. I didn't want to start a gun control debate... just get let the community know.

I'm also quite upset at the 'montage' narrated by Dana Jacobson that is being aired on ESPN. No less than 3 hours after he passed, they threw together a highlight film of the trouble he got in on and off the field. Not the first guy from a hard neighborhood to run into trouble at the age of 20 when being a high draft pick with a higher paycheck. I'm a Skins fan through and through and this event has shocked and disgusted me among other emotions. I just hope they can find these characters.

RIP 21. Hail.

[Beta]

I'm also quite upset at the 'montage' narrated by Dana Jacobson that is being aired on ESPN. No less than 3 hours after he passed, they threw together a highlight film of the trouble he got in on and off the field. Not the first guy from a hard neighborhood to run into trouble at the age of 20 when being a high draft pick with a higher paycheck. I'm a Skins fan through and through and this event has shocked and disgusted me among other emotions. I just hope they can find these characters.

I agree, it barely covered the good things he did on the field...and made ZERO mention of anything good off of the field. They even blew some of his hits out of proportion. "He had a devastating hit on a punter, during a fake punt" talking about his on the field issues...I was like "sweet....that's the best time to nail the little soccer player". It's one of the first times I can remember that I have been absolutely disgusted by ESPN.

[Zeuslax]

I agree, it barely covered the good things he did on the field...and made ZERO mention of anything good off of the field. They even blew some of his hits out of proportion. "He had a devastating hit on a punter, during a fake punt" talking about his on the field issues...I was like "sweet....that's the best time to nail the little soccer player". It's one of the first times I can remember that I have been absolutely disgusted by ESPN.

I saw the same thing last night when I got home from work......and thought the same thing. At least the Clinton Portis quotes and video got a bunch of play.

Gun control? I grew up in Baltimore. About 8 blocks (many parts of the city streets divide) from me was a war zone. On our side it's always sunny, flowers are always blooming and the birds never stopped singing. People across the city and county are screaming to get the guns off the streets. The impact is in your face. When your kid is caught in the cross fire or shot while playing in their room the politics and the constitution go right out the window. There’s a lot of people sleeping in bathtubs. You know the old ceramic kind with the claw feet. We redid ours and it looks great!

[StrykerFSU]

It's very easy to blame guns but would outlawing them really have prevented this from happening? Do we think the murderer was using a legally purchased, registered firearm to commit this crime? Cocaine is outlawed in this country but I'd be happy to tell you at least 5 street corners within walking distance of FSU's campus where you can get a gram for $50.

For those that are truly interested in this debate, the Supreme Court is getting ready to hear a case involving the right to own firearms in D.C. Firearms have been outlawed in the District since 1976 and as anyone who knows the area can tell you D.C. is one of the deadliest towns around. In this case, a security guard has sued the City for the right to own a handgun for personal protection, District of Columbia v. Heller.

For a brief synopsis:
http://www.tallahassee.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071128/OPINION05/711280305/1006/OPINION

Michael Wilbon also had some very interesting things to say in this morning's Washington Post:

I wasn't surprised in the least when I heard the news Monday morning that Sean Taylor had been shot in his home by an intruder. Angry? Yes. Surprised? Not even a little. It was only in June 2006 that Taylor, originally charged with a felony, pleaded no contest to assault and battery charges after brandishing a gun during a battle over who took his all-terrain vehicles in Florida. After that, an angry crew pulled up on Taylor and his boys and pumped at least 15 bullets into his sport-utility vehicle. So why would anybody be surprised? Had it been Shawn Springs, I would have been stunned. But not Sean Taylor.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/27/AR2007112702680.html

[Danny Hogan]

I'm also quite upset at the 'montage' narrated by Dana Jacobson that is being aired on ESPN. No less than 3 hours after he passed, they threw together a highlight film of the trouble he got in on and off the field. Not the first guy from a hard neighborhood to run into trouble at the age of 20 when being a high draft pick with a higher paycheck. I'm a Skins fan through and through and this event has shocked and disgusted me among other emotions. I just hope they can find these characters.

I agree, it barely covered the good things he did on the field...and made ZERO mention of anything good off of the field. They even blew some of his hits out of proportion. "He had a devastating hit on a punter, during a fake punt" talking about his on the field issues...I was like "sweet....that's the best time to nail the little soccer player". It's one of the first times I can remember that I have been absolutely disgusted by ESPN.

I can't say i agree. As a life-long die-hard skins fan, i tend to agree more with Wilbon's sentiment.
A true tragedy, but not shocking.
With Sean Taylor, on the field it was always a countdown to his next costly USC penalty and off the field it was usually a countdown to his next legal battle.

I had actually remarked a number of times to a good friend who is also a redskin's fan (21 was his favorite player) that "they better trade him while he is still worth it, before he kills someone or something"

Though from all accounts he had recently turned his life around.

[Beta]

Though he may have had problems...I don't think anything resembling a memorial needs to have negatives in it. I prefer the funerals I have gone to...to remember the good times...than to sit around talking about the bad.

I'm sure he stole someone's milk money in 4th grade, or got a parking ticket 2 years ago. I'd rather hear about his love for his daughter, or his wife, or his love for the game, or his teammates love for him. And not ESPN's "memorial":

He plays dirty
He gets in trouble
He was on probation
He came from a troubled youth
He was arrested
He hit someone late
He got into a fight on the field
Oh BTW he had a daughter and stuff

[Danny Hogan]

agree they could have presented it with a little more tact, what i saw went through all his UM football accomplishments, his brief pro career and then mentioned all the other "news" he made over the years. I chuckled when they mentioned that he decked a punter in the pro bowl.

[cjwilhelmi]

I was talking to a guy at work yesterday who's favorite player is the recently passed 21. I haven't followed the story too closely but it seemed like he had and here is a brief synapsis of what he told me. Please remember that I haven't followed it and this is just from a third party.

I have confirmed some of the details through a google search so things that are speculative will be in italics.

-Someone broke into is home on the 17th and went through drawers and such but stole nothing.
-Someone again broke into his home on the 26th.
-The alarm system had been tampered with since it did not go off.
-The phone line was also cut. Response time to a cell phone call is slower due to having to give out an address.
-Mr. Taylor grabbed a machete from under his bed to go investigate the noise.
-Intruder broke down their bedroom door, firing two bullets at Mr. Taylor of which one hit him in the upper leg/groin/abdomen and broke his femoral artery.
-Again, nothing was stolen.
-Mr. Taylor's girlfriend and 18 month old daughter were unharmed.

Above information came from Boston Globe as well as from my buddy at work. Unconfirmed details are in italics.

Interesting to note - why in the world would anyone have a machete underneath his bed? According to this News Article the machete is becoming increasingly popular with gang members. Not so say that Mr. Taylor was a gang member, but wouldn't it be easier to just have a gun in your dresser drawer?

All of this adds up to a very interesting idea - this was no simple robbery, it was a gang hit.

Enter Mr. Wilbon's thoughts here again.

[LaxRef]

Not so say that Mr. Taylor was a gang member, but wouldn't it be easier to just have a gun in your dresser drawer?

I thought he wasn't allowed to have a gun because of his probation.