Going Varsity?

[bste_lax]

That's the one thing many people fail to realize about adding varsity teams at major D1 schools like FSU. The club team is not "elevated" to varsity. There will still be a club team.

Someone told me that if you have a varsity team at a school you can't have a team playing in MDIA (for example, there's no Syracuse MDIA team AFAIK, even though they could probably get a pretty darn good MDIA team together there). Is that true? If it is, where would the FSU club team end up playing?

True and either a men's league in Florida or NCLL.

[Catlax]

I understand that the varsity team will attempt to recruit better lacrosse players and it is not an elevation of the club team. Lacrosse in Florida is not yet lacrosse in Maryland, Virginia, or even North Carolina. In order to be successful at the ACC level, FSU will have to get top notch players from the hotbeds of hs lacrosse, where the other ACC teams already have a strong foothold.

The ACC is strict about admitting "marginal" student-athletes so that won't really help FSU. The best players in the country are going to be more interested in having a legitimate shot at a National Championship than they are the quality of coeds.

I'm not saying FSU will never compete at a high level, I'm saying they would be better off competing as an independent until their program gains legitimacy. Then they can take on the ACC.

[bbandlax]

The ACC is strict about admitting "marginal" student-athletes so that won't really help FSU. The best players in the country are going to be more interested in having a legitimate shot at a National Championship than they are the quality of coeds.

I agree it will take some time to develop a competitive team, but the limiting factor will not be ACC admittance standards. The ACC is no different than any other conference in the country. Just look at the GPA's of many of the incoming freshman playing football in the ACC.

[Sonny]

I'm not saying FSU will never compete at a high level, I'm saying they would be better off competing as an independent until their program gains legitimacy. Then they can take on the ACC.

I don't think they will have that choice, if they decide to field a varsity men's squad. It's my understanding that if the (ACC) conference sponsors a championship event (i.e. the ACC Lacrosse Championship), all member schools have to compete in it due to ACC bylaws. The only difference is sports where there isn't a official conference championship like ice hockey. (BC can compete in another conference or as an independent).

[Sonny]

The ACC is strict about admitting "marginal" student-athletes so that won't really help FSU. The best players in the country are going to be more interested in having a legitimate shot at a National Championship than they are the quality of coeds.

I agree it will take some time to develop a competitive team, but the limiting factor will not be ACC admittance standards. The ACC is no different than any other conference in the country. Just look at the GPA's of many of the incoming freshman playing football in the ACC.

While the ACC isn't fielding all Rhodes scholars on the gridiron, they do enforce conference rules that do not accept partial qualifiers unlike other most other 1-A schools and conferences.

[Danny Hogan]

I'm not saying FSU will never compete at a high level, I'm saying they would be better off competing as an independent until their program gains legitimacy. Then they can take on the ACC.

RE: sonny's post i don't think they have a choice with conf participation. Also i think they would be very good very fast. (4 years maybe?) It would not be hard to find top LI and Balto kids ready to go to school somewhere like fsu.

[Jolly Roger]

It would not be hard to find top LI and Balto kids ready to go to school somewhere like fsu.

Based on the history of some of their current players, it's probably not that hard to get kids into such an "academically challenging" institution either.

[Zeuslax]

I think people would be surprised at how quickly a school like FSU could recruit. They are geographically located where there isn't any competition. Also, the South East is comparable to MI, OH, and Il just a few years ago. Very few schools were recruiting there untill they found out that the kids could really play. They would essentially be locking up future recruiting grounds long before anyone else.

The growth of the sport will dictate the addition of varsity programs. Its like a wave. Administrations may be slow to realize that club teams are putting people in the stands. Once they find that its marketable to a certain type of student. Also, that some cost could be offset by some revenue and that a team wouldn't be just a money pit. They may be more in tune to an addition. (of course therei s more to the decision than the above)

Know some people that have played ACC ball (lacrosse & Basketball). Dummies by no means, slackers maybe. ACC Football is by no means indicative of the other sports. Typically even the basketball programs recruit only quality individuals.

[Catlax]

I agree it will take some time to develop a competitive team, but the limiting factor will not be ACC admittance standards. The ACC is no different than any other conference in the country. Just look at the GPA's of many of the incoming freshman playing football in the ACC.

The ACC has strict limitations on the students that a member school can accept and they cannot accept non-qualifiers or ( I believe) even partial qualifiers (at least for football and basketball). That in and of itself is more restrictive than most, if not all other conferences. I believe they also have academic restrictions for other sports, but I'm not sure they are as stringent as the big two.

[SElaxalum]

FSU would go through the same growing pains as any new divisional sport. As for attracting athletes, your crazy if you dont believe they would get prime recruits fast. A brand new program, with brand new facilities, 80 degrees all year round, and the most beautiful women in the country...i dont think people will pass that up for staying in towson. My prediction, within 4 years of fielding a varsity team they will be legitimate title contenders.

[Catlax]

I'd take that bet! Ask Ohio State and Notre Dame how long it took them to even crack the top 20. They are closer to the traditional recruiting hotbeds than FSU and only Notre Dame is getting top recruits consistently now. And they're Notre Dame!

[SElaxalum]

exactly, they are Notre Dame, They market to only a percentage of the population. a flight from maryland to fsu is 2 hours....its not as long distance as people think. they will get the athletes, just like they do in every other sport.

[bbandlax]

The ACC has strict limitations on the students that a member school can accept and they cannot accept non-qualifiers or ( I believe) even partial qualifiers (at least for football and basketball). That in and of itself is more restrictive than most, if not all other conferences. I believe they also have academic restrictions for other sports, but I'm not sure they are as stringent as the big two.

I understand what you are saying, but we are talking about a 2.0 gpa. In the lacrosse world much of the top recruiting is going on at schools where there is a ton of academic support and very few kids come out as non-qualifiers.

There are also several appeal processes for partial qualifiers to be able to fulfill their eligibility requirements. It happens all the time, even here at UVa.

[Danny Hogan]

I'd take that bet! Ask Ohio State and Notre Dame how long it took them to even crack the top 20. They are closer to the traditional recruiting hotbeds than FSU and only Notre Dame is getting top recruits consistently now. And they're Notre Dame!

while i'de take that bet as well, i still think it would be a lot easier to recruit to FSU than OSU or ND.

[Zeuslax]

From what I understand, some universities have a policy that if one school adds a team the other (a rival school; academically, geographically, and athletically speaking) will counter by adding the same organization. Someone mentioned to me that if a team like U of M went varsity in lacrosse, then Michigan State would would counter with a team also. I wouldn't necessarily think that this is a policy. Sounds more like a "keeping you with the Jones" idea.

Any truth to this? Do any institutions have this kind of policy that anyone knows of. JP, you would probably know. You eluded to this when mentioning Adrian College.