Legality of deflecting loose crosse

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Legality of deflecting loose crosse

Postby Sonny on Wed Mar 19, 2008 10:07 am

Saw a play in a NCAA Div 1 game this past weekend that was interesting.

B1 is defending A1 on a clear. B1 attempts to check A1, but is unsuccesful and lose control of his crosse. The crosse is momentarily stuck on A1's jersey. B1 stops running (due in part to avoid going offside)... A1 takes a few more steps and then uses his free hand to flick (more like throw) the loose crosse away from him as he continues toward the goal his team is attacking.

Ruling if any?
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Re: Legality of deflecting loose crosse

Postby LaxRef on Wed Mar 19, 2008 10:19 am

Sonny wrote:Saw a play in a NCAA Div 1 game this past weekend that was interesting.

B1 is defending A1 on a clear. B1 attempts to check A1, but is unsuccesful and lose control of his crosse. The crosse is momentarily stuck on A1's jersey. B1 stops running (due in part to avoid going offside)... A1 takes a few more steps and then uses his free hand to flick (more like throw) the loose crosse away from him as he continues toward the goal his team is attacking.

Ruling if any?


No on-point rule here, so I think common sense has to prevail: no call.

A1 is being disadvantaged by having B1's stick stuck to him. B1 is being disadvantaged by his stick moving away from him at a high rate of speed. Allowing A1 to free himself is a net gain for everyone.
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Postby laxfan25 on Wed Mar 19, 2008 5:15 pm

I agree with the no-call - what did they call in the game?
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Postby Sonny on Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:57 am

laxfan25 wrote:I agree with the no-call - what did they call in the game?


It was a no-call during the game.
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Postby Champ on Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:14 pm

Not related:

If an attackmen or defensemen losses his stick onto the other side (and can't get it for off sides reasons) what does he have to do? Leave the field? Ref gets it for him? Can he step over quick just to grab his stick if play is controlled on the other end? etc.
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Postby laxfan25 on Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:25 pm

Probably the smart thing would be to head to the substitution box and get subbed for. You obviously cannot participate in play at all without your stick, so you're pretty much useless on the field. As long as the loose stick isn't interfering with play, it can stay there until the next whistle. If it did become a hazard the ref would most likely call time-out and give the ball to the team that had it or award by alternate possession if the ball was loose and people were contesting it in the area of the loose stick.

Depending on the situation, if the ball is at one end the refs may not see or "see" the player step over and retrieve it, but you do run the risk of getting called for offsides. If your team has the ball or it's loose it's just a possession call, but could be 30 sec if the other team has it and you get flagged.
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Postby horn17 on Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:42 pm

or..you could ask your defenseman covering you to try to rake it back for you (that is if your playing nice!!) :lol:
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Postby Sonny on Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:52 pm

horn17 wrote:or..you could ask your defenseman covering you to try to rake it back for you (that is if your playing nice!!) :lol:


I've heard D-man who flicked the attackman's crosse even further away from the midfield line. ;)
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Postby laxfan25 on Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:54 pm

Sonny wrote:
horn17 wrote:or..you could ask your defenseman covering you to try to rake it back for you (that is if your playing nice!!) :lol:


I've heard D-man who flicked the attackman's crosse even further away from the midfield line. ;)

But don't let the refs see you do that - a definite no-no! (Although I'd be tempted if I was the d-man!)
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Postby BucLax13 on Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:55 pm

what would be the ruling if a D-man did that?

I have seen an attackman lose his stick with the ball still in pocket... can the d-man check his stick on the ground... can he flick it or push it to retrieve the ball from the pocket...

Also if a person loses his stick next to a ball... can you check it as the player picks it up... can you hold it down with your stick? (dirty but I can see this happeneing)
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Postby laxfan25 on Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:18 pm

BucLax13 wrote:what would be the ruling if a D-man did that?

I have seen an attackman lose his stick with the ball still in pocket... can the d-man check his stick on the ground... can he flick it or push it to retrieve the ball from the pocket...

Also if a person loses his stick next to a ball... can you check it as the player picks it up... can you hold it down with your stick? (dirty but I can see this happeneing)


Here are the pertinent A.R.'s (under the Interference Technical Foul section)that address your questions...

A.R. 45. A1 drops his crosse, which is not broken, and B1 (1) Accidentally steps on or kicks A1’s crosse; or (2) Intentionally steps on, kicks or otherwise moves A1’s crosse to try to keep A1 from recovering it. RULING: (1) No foul for interference because the crosse is not in A1's possession. (2) Unsportsmanlike conduct on B1.

A.R. 46. A1, in a crowded scrimmage area, drops his crosse with the ball in it. (1) A1 tries to retrieve his crosse. (2) A2 or B1 kicks the crosse on the ground to try to gain access to the ball. (3) A2 or B1 uses his crosse to try to gain access to the ball. RULING: If the ball is stuck in the crosse, immediate whistle and award the ball to Team B. Otherwise: (1) Illegal procedure on A1 for participating in the play without equipment. (2) No foul. (3) No foul.
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Postby Tim Gray on Thu Mar 20, 2008 5:08 pm

laxfan25 wrote:
BucLax13 wrote:what would be the ruling if a D-man did that?

I have seen an attackman lose his stick with the ball still in pocket... can the d-man check his stick on the ground... can he flick it or push it to retrieve the ball from the pocket...

Also if a person loses his stick next to a ball... can you check it as the player picks it up... can you hold it down with your stick? (dirty but I can see this happeneing)


Here are the pertinent A.R.'s (under the Interference Technical Foul section)that address your questions...

A.R. 45. A1 drops his crosse, which is not broken, and B1 (1) Accidentally steps on or kicks A1’s crosse; or (2) Intentionally steps on, kicks or otherwise moves A1’s crosse to try to keep A1 from recovering it. RULING: (1) No foul for interference because the crosse is not in A1's possession. (2) Unsportsmanlike conduct on B1.

A.R. 46. A1, in a crowded scrimmage area, drops his crosse with the ball in it. (1) A1 tries to retrieve his crosse. (2) A2 or B1 kicks the crosse on the ground to try to gain access to the ball. (3) A2 or B1 uses his crosse to try to gain access to the ball. RULING: If the ball is stuck in the crosse, immediate whistle and award the ball to Team B. Otherwise: (1) Illegal procedure on A1 for participating in the play without equipment. (2) No foul. (3) No foul.


Wait, so if you drop your stick with the ball in it, you can't try and pick it up?

Another question, A1 drops his stick and ball remains in his stick, with in the offensive possession box. Coach A calls Time Out. Is that a legal TO? Does team A still have possession?
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Postby laxfan25 on Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:17 pm

That's how it looks by the rulebook Tim! I never really had taken note of that, but then whenever someone has had their stick pinwheel-checked out of their hands in any game I've ever done the ball hasn't remained in the stick.
I guess you've just got to stand there while they fight over the ball in your stick, and once the play moves on, go and retrieve it.
As far as calling a timeout with the ball in a stick on the ground, I wouldn't consider that possession, so a timeout would not be allowed.
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Postby LaxRef on Thu Mar 20, 2008 10:27 pm

laxfan25 wrote:That's how it looks by the rulebook Tim! I never really had taken note of that, but then whenever someone has had their stick pinwheel-checked out of their hands in any game I've ever done the ball hasn't remained in the stick.
I guess you've just got to stand there while they fight over the ball in your stick, and once the play moves on, go and retrieve it.
As far as calling a timeout with the ball in a stick on the ground, I wouldn't consider that possession, so a timeout would not be allowed.


You certainly can't cradle, pass, or shoot without holding the stick, so it's not possession.
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Postby Tim Gray on Fri Mar 21, 2008 8:22 am

LaxRef wrote:
laxfan25 wrote:That's how it looks by the rulebook Tim! I never really had taken note of that, but then whenever someone has had their stick pinwheel-checked out of their hands in any game I've ever done the ball hasn't remained in the stick.
I guess you've just got to stand there while they fight over the ball in your stick, and once the play moves on, go and retrieve it.
As far as calling a timeout with the ball in a stick on the ground, I wouldn't consider that possession, so a timeout would not be allowed.


You certainly can't cradle, pass, or shoot without holding the stick, so it's not possession.


It happened in a game once with the opposing attack man falling down, and his stick kinda slid out of his hand, ball remained within stick, and opposing coach called for and was awarded a TO. I was given the explanation, that they technically still had possession of the ball. I had never seen it happen before, so I wasn't really sure if I had a right to argue the call. Oh well.
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