Field Marking (Crease/Goal line) questions inside(edited)

[Laxbacker]

Questions for the Refs:

Team B is the visiting team and Team A the home team. It is a high school game. I do not have access to a Fed. Book so I 'm referencing the NCAA wording.

http://www.ncaa.org/library/rules/2006/ ... _rules.pdf

Preface to the questions: I paint the field for team B and understand the rule, in the question [ Section 4 (pg 14). ], to state that crease and goal lines must be "plainly marked" so I always use white field paint for any part of the crease and goal in the "spirit" of the wording. I also understand that the rule doesn't specify color.

Upon visiting team A's field, team B realizes that the lines were all "blue." The reason they were so hard to see is because they were painted on a dark green winter wry grass field.

This brings me to my questions.

1.a. What discretion does a Ref get to use in this situation?

1.b. Is it even up to the Ref to take any action without a request from team B?

The Problem: It seemed that the Refs were having difficulty discerning the crease lines without moving in too close,but did a remarkable job, IMO.

Disclaimer: This situation had, IMO, no impact on the final outcome of the contest, but just piqued my curiousity.

2a. What recourse does the team B have in this situation, if any?

2b. Could team B have demanded a better contrasting choice of color, prior to faceoff? [ "A.R. 3" (pg 13). ]

Comment: To add to the confusion, team A's crease was painted in blue but a Girl's LAX crease was marked in a contrasting color but overlapped team A's crease by 5-6 feet. Whew! Rather busy, no?

I sincerely hope this question meets compliance with the board rules. I really did not mean to violate any of them.

Anyway. thanks in advance.

Sorry for the rant.

[Sonny]

Is this high school (i.e. Federation Rules apply?) or college (i.e. NCAA rules apply)?

[Laxbacker]

Federation - GHSA

[Sonny]

Please review the guidelines for posting in this forum laxbacker:
http://forums.uslia.com/viewtopic.php?t=2558

1. No references to actual teams, players or officials – If you have a game situation you would like to discuss, please phrase it as Team A and Team B, or A1 checked B2, etc. No specific references to MDIA teams/players/coaches will be allowed!

[LaxRef]

There are a few issues here:

First, if the game starts with no penalty applied, it's assumed that both teams are satisfied with the field and there can be no penalty assessed (NCAA or NFHS).

In NFHS, there's actually no penalty for field markings being illegal; you're supposed to do the best you can and report it to the league. The goals do have to be legal or a 3:00 NR penalty is assessed; some people interpret the crease to be "part of the goal." I know I'd be inclined to penalize if there was no crease.

In NCAA, if the field isn't right, they have to correct it by the scheduled start time. If they do, no foul. If the game is delayed, it's illegal procedure and the ball is awarded to the other team (no opening faceoff). If they don't fix it, 3:00 NR penalty.

Also, the officials are theoretically supposed to check the field and penalize if it isn't right. In practice, the officials may choose to overlook a violation if the vissiting coach doesn't bring it up unless the violation will affect the play of the game (for example, not having a 4-inch contrasting color square at midfield in NCAA doesn't keep you from playing the game; not having a crease or a midfield line screws everything up and must be penalized.

Anyway, I think the officials probably did the right thing, assuming they complained to the league about the poor field markings.

[Sonny]

I know I'd be inclined to penalize if there was no crease.

Maybe I'm reading too much into your post.... but I would imagine that it would be pretty hard to start the game without a crease(s). So I don't know how you could penalize a team for this "omission" (after the start of the contest).

Tell the home coach to fix it. If he doesn't comply, no game that day. I would file this as an "unsafe condition" for the players on the field.

[Laxbacker]

Thanks, LaxRef for clearing up the difference between NCAA and NFHS. It really justy puzzled the heck out of me. Now I can go on with my life.

By the way Team A's goal lines were 4" blue lines. Grrrr!

Probably just an oversite where an industrious parent did it and the coach was not aware.

Oh well. Cest la vie!

Team B will continue to use white paint on their crease and goal lines.

Besides, it just looks better.

[LaxRef]

I know I'd be inclined to penalize if there was no crease.

Maybe I'm reading too much into your post.... but I would imagine that it would be pretty hard to start the game without a crease(s). So I don't know how you could penalize a team for this "omission" (after the start of the contest).

Tell the home coach to fix it. If he doesn't comply, no game that day. I would file this as an "unsafe condition" for the players on the field.

It's one of those weird things in the rules. I'd love to have the 3:00 NR stick to wield at teams that don't line their fields correctly, but the book doesn't give it to us. They tell us to try to play the game if at all possible. In fact, look at situation 1.2 on p. 62; there's no provision there for doing anything other than playing the game, and I think there should be.

But realistically, what is much more likely to happen is for a team to have wrong-sized creases (I've seen confusion between "diameter" and "radius"!). In this case, I think you probably could play the game, but I'm threatening the coach with a 3:00 NR penalty if he doesn't get it fixed for
the game.

[LaxRef]

By the way Team A's goal lines were 4" blue lines. Grrrr!

It should be 2", but a 4" goal line is a minor problem. You just move the goal so the rear edge of the pipe is lined up with the rear edge of the line. No penalty for this one, at least not from me!

In NCAA play now, though, if you don't have a 4-inch midline I think you need to throw the 3:00 NR penalty since faceoffs are predicated on having a 4-inch centerline. In NFHS, I'd love to get a 4-inch centerline, but I'll take what I can get.

[Sonny]

I know I'd be inclined to penalize if there was no crease.

Maybe I'm reading too much into your post.... but I would imagine that it would be pretty hard to start the game without a crease(s). So I don't know how you could penalize a team for this "omission" (after the start of the contest).

Tell the home coach to fix it. If he doesn't comply, no game that day. I would file this as an "unsafe condition" for the players on the field.

It's one of those weird things in the rules. I'd love to have the 3:00 NR stick to wield at teams that don't line their fields correctly, but the book doesn't give it to us. They tell us to try to play the game if at all possible. In fact, look at situation 1.2 on p. 62; there's no provision there for doing anything other than playing the game, and I think there should be.

But realistically, what is much more likely to happen is for a team to have wrong-sized creases (I've seen confusion between "diameter" and "radius"!). In this case, I think you probably could play the game, but I'm threatening the coach with a 3:00 NR penalty if he doesn't get it fixed for
the game.

I know the NFHS rules tell us to play the game regardless how the field is lined, but there is virtually no way you could play a lacrosse game without a crease. It is 100% UNSAFE for the participants. This isn't about a field that doesn't have faulty markings (too long, too short, no limit lines, no substitution box, etc.).

I'd love to hear the story of a boys game played without any crease markings. I know I wouldn't officiate that game (regardless of what the NFHS book says).