Top 25 D2 Results for Poll #4

[Gvlax]

I'll add a bit more to GVLax's comment above. This game was hands down one of the best regular season games I've seen in the last few years of Div. B. Having played and coached for one of the best teams in the division over the past few years, I would like to think that is a pretty exhaustive analysis. Although the team I was cheering for lost, it was still an awesome game to be at.

A few thoughts: The easy one is that GVSU is way too low at #19. They have an incredibly fluid offense and if you look at their box scores, can decipher that they have little trouble scoring. Their attack unit is extremely fluid, efficient and incredibly accurate with both feeding and shooting. Both GVSU and UST have very potent offenses, but they are very different. UST tended to score with longer possessions while GVSU ran the break incredibly well and capitalized on many EMO opportunities. Again, a great sign of their efficiency.

GVSU has hands down the best face-off specialist UST has faced in 4 years. Good on the draw and if he lost it, was good at getting the ball back in the scrum. It was a battle in the middle all day.

GVSU's goalie was stellar. UST took a ton of shots. Not sure what his final save number was as many shots went wide, but the kid could play. Both teams showed signs of brilliance and mediocrity when it came to the clear/ride. But in a game with so many ups and downs that is bound to happen.

The last 6 minutes of the game was completely nuts. It was awesome to see. it was as if UST just decided to come alive and clawed back to tie it with :10 left in regulation.

If GVSU and Dayton meet in the CCLA finals it will be epic. I haven't seen Dayton play since last year, but I know GVSU is a very good team, worthy of in my opinion a top 10 slot. They may not get it in the next poll because of the size of the jump they would have to make, but I believe they'll get there. They didn't have the indulgence of previous year's success to get them high in the early polls and that's why they're so low right now. They'll earn it the hard way though. I was very impressed with the way both teams played on Sunday, and it was a privilege to be there.

Definitely a game worth watching. Glad someone was there to give a review. I do agree if GVSU meets up with Dayton at the CCLA Championship it could be a great game. I am interested to see Dayton vs SJU and STU this weekend.

[scooter]

I echo the sentiments about GVSU.... They definitely deserve a Top 10 ranking. Voters should really pay attention to the season they are having; because in my opinion, they deserve to be in the conversation with the Westminsters, SJU, UST; the best. Hopefully the get an at large bid to nationals to show the rest of the country what they can do.

[Dr. Jason Stockton]

I agree with Scooter and think the two most underrated teams in the poll are GVSU at 19 and UPS at 15.

I must also admit that I am a bit perplexed by Southwestern's No. 12 ranking. . .doesn't it seem a bit high for a team that has not defeated a single team with a winning record this season? I just don't see how at 5-4 this team can be ranked ahead of two undefeated teams in GVSU and UPS.

[Pinball]

With UST's close loss to #19 GVSU and a close 3OT win vs #10 Charlotte are they overanked this year, or just working out some early season bumps. I talked to a good non-partial (basically not a johnnie) that saw the GVSU game and they mentioned that UST just didnt look as fluid as the past couple of years committing dumb penalties, dropping passes and making goalies look like all-stars with bad shots. No knock on GVSU or UNCC but i think that UST is a lot better team then they have shown in this first part of the year. They should drop in the polls to reflect that though and hopefully dosent drop them out of the contention for that At-large bid coem tourney time.

[Gvlax]

With UST's close loss to #19 GVSU and a close 3OT win vs #10 Charlotte are they overanked this year, or just working out some early season bumps. I talked to a good non-partial (basically not a johnnie) that saw the GVSU game and they mentioned that UST just didnt look as fluid as the past couple of years committing dumb penalties, dropping passes and making goalies look like all-stars with bad shots. No knock on GVSU or UNCC but i think that UST is a lot better team then they have shown in this first part of the year. They should drop in the polls to reflect that though and hopefully dosent drop them out of the contention for that At-large bid coem tourney time.

Well it wont be in time for the poll this week but Dayton is going to play UST and SJU this weekend so it will be interesting to see them play a higher ranked opponent.

Also it might seem like a big loss to UST if you assume that GVSU was actually the 19th best team in the MCLA going into that game.

[Pinball]

Also it might seem like a big loss to UST if you assume that GVSU was actually the 19th best team in the MCLA going into that game.

That is why it was prefaced with the questioned with the million dollar question of is UST overrated or GVSU underrated?

[USTLAX06]

I think UST is very capable of playing a better game then they did on Sunday. Who knows though, maybe GVSU had a down game too? It's really all speculation. It's one game in the body of work that a team will put together. UST plays 3 of the top teams in the country and I believe all 3 were at nationals last year within the next few weeks. What happens to them in this poll (or the next few) won't be nearly as important as the last poll. Look at some of the jumps we have seen so far. Teams are swinging by ridiculous amounts of points based on just a handfull of games. It's been a total crap shoot. UST has beaten a top 5 team on the road as well, so they are in a bit of a peculiar position.

Look at Montana last year. They stumbled to a couple of losses before they got to the tournament, but their body of work was solid enough at the end of the year to get them in and eventually win the crown.

It's really only about mid season. A lot can happen. UST could easily climb back into the top three, or if they drop a few more could have some serious concerns. The same scenario could happen for a number of teams in the poll. If you go undefeated you are either very legit or just didn't play anyone. I have my theories about some of the Div 2 teams and where things will shake out, but I'm not going to bore you with those, because at mid season, they really just are theories.

[Brew26]

Here is my poll for this week.
1. Westminster 5-3 They are legit. I do not know what happened against Southwestern, but they seem to be capable to beat anyone they play in both divisions. They have no Top 20 wins according to my poll. They played well against Division I teams but could not pull out a win.\
2. St. Johns 4-1 Beat the #6 team in the country with it being their second game of the day which is now #9 in my poll. Lost as well to the one Division I opponent they faced.
3. Dayton 4-0 They have won against both their top 25 opponents.

The deciding factor for Westminster/SJU/Dayton is this weekend with all of them having huge games.

4. Emory 4-2 Looks like they found their defense after the Elon game and can put some points up as well.
5. Fort Lewis College 6-1 Another team that can put up some points and took care of metro which some teams seem to be having trouble with.
6. St. Thomas 6-1 Big loss to GVSU but had some quality wins against Emory and Charlotte. Big weekend coming up as well.
7. Elon 6-1 Close game with Emory and won big against Charlotte.
8. Grand Valley State University 7-0 They can score a lot of goals but have to prove more than just one win in this league against top competition.
9. Utah Valley State 4-2 Lost to UNC and SJU but beat Montana State.
10. SCAD 7-4 Lots of wins against middle class teams. Only win against top 25 is against an overrated CMU team. Not a strong schedule but could be a better team than I think.
11. Montana St. 3-1 Lost to UVSC but two quality top 25 wins against UNC and Metro.
12. Puget Sound 6-0 Quality wins against Central Wash and Western Wash, but I can’t put the PNCLL in the top 10 with each team playing only in their conference.
13. Western Washington 5-3
14. Northern Colorado 3-2 Big win against UVSC but two losses to Montana St. and Metro.
15. Western Oregon 6-2
16. Harding 2-2 They had a close game with Dayton and killed an overrated CMU team.
17. Central Washington 5-2
18. Metro St. 3-2 Both Metro and Mines can play with the top 10 but cannot be consistent with their play. Metro over Mines with their current win against UNC.
19. Colorado School of Mines 3-2 They can play but not consistent enough.
20. Charlotte 4-3 Big loss to Davidson. No wins in top 25 but they can compete.
21. Southwestern 5-4 Way overrated. Played Westminster to a close game but LOST. That loss is their only claim to fame.
22. Crieghton 5-1 No quality wins. Have played lower class teams (trying not to be mean) and beat them. Nothing impressive enough to be in the top 20.
23. U.S. Coast Guard Academy 3-1
24. Davidson 6-1 Big win against Charlotte.
25. Southern Oregon 6-3

*Too hard to judge the PNCLL but it seems like they should be in the 10 to 20 range.

[Kyle Berggren]

This is really close to what my poll would look like.... The top 5-6 teams are all very very good, it will be interesting to see how it shakes out & who gets the first round bye...

[westlax]

There are three things that come to mind PNCLL wise that bother me:
1: Puget Sound is undefeated with wins against what you have as #13 Western Washington and #17 Central Washington but is only ranked 12th.
2: Western Oregon (6-2) is below Western Washington (5-3) even though Western Oregon beat them by 10 in the season opener.
3: Southern Oregon should not be ranked. If you look at their wins this season they go accordingly. Lewis & Clark (0-5), Portland State (Not a MCLA sectioned team), Willamette (4-5), Pacific Lutheran (3-5), Humboldt State (Not a MCLA sectioned team), and San Jose State (2-5). Not one quality opponent.
I see it going more like this:
1. Westminster
2. St. Johns
3. Dayton
4. Fort Lewis College
5. Emory
6. Grand Valley State
7. St. Thomas
8. Elon
9. Puget Sound
10. Utah Valley State
11. Montana State
12. Western Oregon
13. SCAD
14. Western Washington
15. Central Washington
16. Northern Colorado
17. Metro State
18. Colorado School of Mines
19. Harding
20. Davidson
21. Crieghton
22. U.S. Coast Guard
23. Southwestern
24. Charlotte
25. UC- Santa Cruz

[bjlaxman16]

There are three things that come to mind PNCLL wise that bother me:
1: Puget Sound is undefeated with wins against what you have as #13 Western Washington and #17 Central Washington but is only ranked 12th.
2: Western Oregon (6-2) is below Western Washington (5-3) even though Western Oregon beat them by 10 in the season opener.
3: Southern Oregon should not be ranked. If you look at their wins this season they go accordingly. Lewis & Clark (0-5), Portland State (Not a MCLA sectioned team), Willamette (4-5), Pacific Lutheran (3-5), Humboldt State (Not a MCLA sectioned team), and San Jose State (2-5). Not one quality opponent.

1: Well 12 is higher than 13 and 17. And his #12 (UPS) only beat his #13 (WWU) by one goal.
2: True, but Western Washington beat Central Washington, who beat Western Oregon. Another 3-way tie that's hard to sort through.
3: A lot of teams don't have quality wins.

With your poll, you have UVSC 6 spots above UNC, and UNC just beat UVSC 12-5 a couple days ago.

Just showing that no one can get these polls right because there are so many 3-way ties and all kinds of other messes that make it hard to rank everyone until more games are played.

[Kyle Berggren]

I've just been re-reading this & the UST situation is interesting. If they didn't look as fluid on offense as they normally do, you could attribute that to GVSU taking them out of their game. I have a tendency to believe that in tougher games much more so than others, & while GVSU is ranked in the high teens, they are obviously a very capable team. I know I felt we looked poor against WWU, but as much as we couldn't pass & catch to clear the ball, WWU took us out of our game. UST is obviously a top 10 team, they have the track record to back it up & will only get better as the season goes on. UST has opportunities to show they belong in the top 5 throughout the season & I doubt anyone is thinking, "Man I hope I get matched-up against them in the first round @ Dallas."

& UPS is ranked 15th if I remember correctly... 12 was an opinion posted here.

[bjlaxman16]

I've just been re-reading this & the UST situation is interesting. If they didn't look as fluid on offense as they normally do, you could attribute that to GVSU taking them out of their game. I have a tendency to believe that in tougher games much more so than others, & while GVSU is ranked in the high teens, they are obviously a very capable team. I know I felt we looked poor against WWU, but as much as we couldn't pass & catch to clear the ball, WWU took us out of our game. UST is obviously a top 10 team, they have the track record to back it up & will only get better as the season goes on. UST has opportunities to show they belong in the top 5 throughout the season & I doubt anyone is thinking, "Man I hope I get matched-up against them in the first round @ Dallas."

& UPS is ranked 15th if I remember correctly... 12 was an opinion posted here.

I believe UST should still be ranked very high. They are a very good team and will continue to be for years. With the little I saw from their games this weekend and from the other scores they put up, I can't imagine that they had a real bad game. In that case, I would definitely put GVSU up higher.

So either GVSU can run with the best of the D2 teams, or they just happen to play a style that slows down UST's game. But from looking at their other games, I would imagine they will be a top team the rest of the year and make it to Texas.

[Mark Brown]

I'm working on my poll at the moment and am looking for some help outside of the private forum for us voters. Right now I truly don't know how I will fill spots 20-25 and have some ?'s . While I believe Santa Cruz will be very good very soon w/ a strong freshman class, what have they done to get votes? They beat UNLV by 1.
What about Mines? The only win that is getting them in the poll was the first game of the year against a Metro team that didn't have their goalie and put a middie in goal. Since then they lost by 8 to un-ranked NAU.
Coast Guard just lost to Framingham St (PCLL 2), should they be ranked? Even w/ Davidsons quality win it's hard to vote for a team that doesn't enter any game reports or stats ever!
NAU is 2-6 with close losses to quality teams and a strong schedule...but still 2-6.
Missouri S&T- 2-0 w/ wins vs Kansas St. and Wash U in St. Louis...I have no idea what that means or if it is deserving of votes.
Depaul is 0-2
UWEC beat Augustana by 1 and was crushed by 22 by GVSU.
Coastal Carolina is 7-1 w/ their only loss to SCAD so I could see voting for them.
I'm not trying to knock any of these teams. These are just the teams that are being looked at to be in the top #25 and I'm looking for insight as to why they are getting votes. Any teams that I haven't mentioned that should be? Whitman from the PNCLL is one and I think they will be soon enough w/ all 3 of their losses coming by one goal each to 3 top 25 teams. Anyone else? Help please. We really need a poll where there aren't 47 teams getting votes.

[scooter]

We really need a poll where there aren't 47 teams getting votes.

for this we need more schools to play quality ooc schedules.