LaxTV Forums | A Forum About The MCLA

The Dems are in a bit of a pickle. They never figured Michigan and Florida would play a role in the election when they blackballed the two states, but now they might be the difference. What, oh what, is Liberal Nation to do?

I read (http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/09/michigan.florida/index.html) that now the Dems are debating a mail-in ballot for both states. I'm sure the disenfranchisement cabal won't have a problem with that. I find Howard Dean to be cartoonish in his simplicity and I hope he doesn't get the ax in the whole affair, but it seems foresight is not his milieu.

I've read and been told countless times that this election is in the bag for the Dems, but they sure seem to be making it complicated.

The problem, Dean said, is figuring out who would foot the bill.

"The two things, I think, that are established is [Florida] isn't going to pay for it because their governor, who is a [John] McCain supporter, has said they won't pay for it," he said, speaking of Florida Gov. Charlie Crist.

I think this is hilarious, especially because they (the DNC) were the ones that that created this mess in the first place.

But Dean isn't done yet...

Dean says Florida and Michigan cannot be given passes for violating rules that were clear to them.

"The rules were set a year and a half ago. Florida and Michigan voted for them and then decided that they didn't need to abide by the rules. When you're in a contest, you do need to abide by the rules," he said last week.
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"You cannot violate the rules of the process and then expect to get forgiven for it," he said.

So Florida taxpayers should bail out the state DNC parties of FL & MI because they wanted to supercede party rules?

It's your party's mess Mr. Dean! You clean it up.

Sonny it is still a pittance compared to what we as Americans have paid over the past 5+ years to KBR, Blackwater and Haliburton for a Republican mistake, now isn't it?

KnoxVegas wrote:Sonny it is still a pittance compared to what we as Americans have paid over the past 5+ years to KBR, Blackwater and Haliburton for a Republican mistake, now isn't it?

Relevance?

As a Florida taxpayer, I would be livid if the State has to pick up the tab. No way Crist let's this fly and commits political suicide.

who cares... they lose that much daily in mis-appropriated contracts

As a national tax payer, I am livid that my money has gone to Iraq. Though I agree, the relevance to this discussion is limited. Of course, I do have a proper recourse to deal with this wasteful expenditure and that is to vote those out of office who have wasted these funds. Accountability does exist in government...

What about the 40+ million to send people letters that they qualify for the national stimulus package? Doesn't that seem a little wasteful? Why is nobody fired up about that?

No way Crist let's this fly and commits political suicide.

Christ is actually pushing for the re-vote. He wants the election to drag out as long as possible - as any good Republican would.

I don't see the states picking up the tab.

Zeuslax wrote:

No way Crist let's this fly and commits political suicide.

Christ is actually pushing for the re-vote.

Wow I didn't know that Jesus took such an interest in U.S. politics! Good thing we have separation of church and state, we Dems would have no chance running against the "Son of God"!

Wow I didn't know that Jesus took such an interest in U.S. politics! Good thing we have separation of church and state, we Dems would have no chance running against the "Son of God"!

I'm glad someone is picking up what I'm putting down.

Just to make sure everyone is clear, this was not a right-wing conspiracy cooked up by the the Republican majority in the Florida legislature amid protests by the Democrat minority.

"I should be regretting things, but I'm not," said Democratic state Sen. Jeremy Ring, of Parkland. Ring, in his first term, co-sponsored the 2007 bill that moved the primary to January. The intent was for Florida to become a major player in the campaign, with candidates focusing on Florida issues.

"Everything that I wanted to happen happened," Ring said Friday. "It just happened on the Republican side."

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/columnists/sfl-flbmayocol0309sbmar09,0,2670040.column

So, if the national or state Democrat party wants to pay for a re-do, knock yourselves out. Clearly, there is a bit of a difference of opinion between the leadership of the DNC and Democrat elected representatives in The Sunshine State.

peterwho wrote: Clearly, there is a bit of a difference of opinion between the leadership of the DNC and Democrat elected representatives in The Sunshine State.

Well, Duh! If the elected reps of the Sunshine state cared even a whit for the national party and it's leadership they would never have gone ahead and moved the primary up in violation of party rules in the first place.

No matter how much the Clinton camp begs, whines and threatens the Florida delegation will not be seated unless they hold a new primary -- which isn't likely to happen. Howard Dean said so in no uncertain terms and I believe him. Florida's Democratic Party was clearly warned what the repercussions would be of doing so, and they did it anyway.

Clinton won't allow a caucus, which is cheaper, because she knows Obama will trounce her handily in caucus voting. Looks like BO and HC will go to the convention with Obama ahead but short of the pledged delegates needed for nomination. Should be interesting political theater, and I wholeheartedly agree with Jac and my GOP friends here that we remain the wacky, wild party that will continue to shoot itself in the foot...

In the final analysis, however, the general election will come down to whether the voters want to continue with Bush's failed policies on Iraq (and everything else) -- which McCain is embracing almost en toto, or go in a different direction.

PS The special election for Hastert's "safe" GOP seat this weekend went to the Democrats for the first time in 40 years, and this doesn't bode well for the Republicans come November.

Sorry, Dan, if that was all old news to you.

They way the story is being widely reported is that this was a case of the Republican controlled Florida legislature running roughshod over the [poor, defenseless] Democrats when, in fact, a Democrat co-sponsored the bill hoping it would have exactly the impact it has.

I just wanted to make sure everyone understood the facts.

Maybe the story is being reported more accurately outside of South Florida, the bastion of Florida's Democrat Party.

You are 100% correct that this is a Dem self inflicted problem. Also, I would like to remind everyone that you already pay for elections……..not do-over’s.

Let’s step back here and look at voting from a big picture perspective. In my opinion the system is flawed from top to bottom. The amount of local control and decision making regarding procedures, dates and times, methods, accountability, laws, and record keeping is more than fundamentally flawed. This is outside of the vast deficiencies related to the mechanisms to vote and the new issues revolving around record keeping. We have the party nuances (see MI & FL in 2008), federal and state laws that create huge walls for third party candidates and then we have incumbent favoritism on the ballots. Let’s start here: Election Day should be a one or two day (half the country on one day and the other half on the next) federal holiday where everyone has off. The results should be held until the West Coast precincts are closed. We should remove local gradation from ballots. The ballot should be very simple. Black and white with the same font and font size and a big box next to the name of the candidates to check your selection. If electronic voting is used two receipts should be printed; one for the precinct and one for the voter. Lastly, all of the machines should be exactly the same. The first question is always who’s going to pay for something like this? We would, should and already do if you pay taxes. It would be much cheaper, safer, cleaner and more efficient. Instead our elected officials continue to pass brilliant legislation like the federal law forcing states to use electronic voting machines. When a state election supervisor writes appeals and editorials urging people to not use electronic voting we have a huge problem in this country. When the whole world laughed at the greatest democracy in 00 and 04 this should have been a wake up call. As a substitute, we continue to tweak what should be an elementary process and turn it into a severely defected scheme.

At the most basic level we need to remove the restrictions and hurdles that people have to go through to vote.

I say Illiminate both candidates and We'll (republicans) give you McCain. I mean he's just a republican in name. I amm shocked he won the election spot because every republican i have talked to hates him. He is purely a democrat in sheeps clothing. I will probably vote Obama if he is the Democrat candidate, he is more conservative on several issues than McCain is. Which is kinda weird actually.

I didn't see an option for a likely outcome - a caucus in Michigan and a primary in Florida - paid for by the candidates. While Hillary might agree through gritted teeth, the impact of ignoring the populations of Michigan and Florida is too great, even though she "won".
I might have screwed myself in Michigan though. Since there wasn't a real contest the first time around, I switched to the GOP so I could hang my chad for Mitt Romney. I heard that you had to have voted on the Democratic side in the first primary to be eligible for a do-over.
It certainly has been an interesting campaign season - serious disenchantment from people on both sides of the aisle with their prospective candidates - and many of my suppositions have not been borne out - imagine that!
Given that Sen McCain has hitched his wagon firmly to a successful outcome in Iraq - and I'm not convinced that the picture will be improved by fall - that is his equivalent of an "all-in". Since another truism is that "It's the economy, stupid!" - and I don't believe we are even close to the bottom - there will be some very worried and upset people come November. I'll still take the Dems in the general election - the only question is - who will it be?