N. Colorado's final consolation game is kaput

[Dr. Jason Stockton]

Regional tournaments make no sense. It's a nice concept, but totally impractical. Start thinking about how the regions would be broken up, and then think about the travel costs. . .Say, Dayton travelling to Southwestern or Harding going to Westminster?. . .and then IF they win they get to travel again the next weekend to Texas? It becomes much more expensive, potentially more school missed. . .it just doesn't make financial sense.

Possible regional breakdowns fo '07:

UC Irvine at Montana
Southwestern at Westminster
Harding at St. John's
Salem State at Emory
. . .and then who does Dayton play?

This all follows a trip to a conference tournament, which could be 12 hours away. . .and then precedes a flight or drive to Texas?

The biggest barrier typically with B division teams is small teams with small budgets. . .I don't see how adding another layer of expense would solve ANY of our problems.


We are having growing pains in the B division. It's embarassing and frustrating, but please keep in mind we are in year 3 of a B championship. We don't need to blow the whole thing up. . . we need to take measures to minimize these blemishes on future seasons.

[lax4ever]

youre right i conceed

[unclaxman23]

Embarrassing yes...frustrating yes...but the #6 team in the nation (b division) just got worked by a bunch of LSA guys who haven't touched their sticks in 6 weeks. That IS embarrassing! Really it is. Downgrade the B tourney until the B division figures out that nationals is a privilege, not a right because you won your 'b' division league. I mean REALLY. owned.

You need to get your facts straight buddy!!! we didn't get worked it was not a real game. o and d switched in the first half, you need to take a chill pill before you say that we were embarrassing. what is embarrassing is that we had 2 teams not show up to play!

[warri0rlax22]

Embarrassing yes...frustrating yes...but the #6 team in the nation (b division) just got worked by a bunch of LSA guys who havent touched their sticks in 6 weeks. That IS embarrassing! Really it is. Downgrade the B tourney until the B division figures out that nationals is a privilege, not a right because you won your 'b' division league. I mean REALLY. owned.

first of all that game didnt mean anything to us. I am personally pretty pissed off about this situation. Granted most of the people on this board only go off what they read so here it goes.

When i first heard about us having to play some "all star team" this pissed me off as well as the rest of the team. Im glad so we scraped all of our money together to stuff ourselves in 15 passenger vans and drive for 18 hours and end up playing some bush league game. I guess this is what you get when you come to nationals when offered the chance, win your first game, and lose to IMO the best team in dallas, Montana. maybe next year we should think about saying we dont have the talent to compete or just leave early because we lose. Sorry we come to nationals planning to stay the entire week and compete for a national title.

At the start of that game we had players playing all different positions. After the first quarter we switched back. the game was played running clock and 1 minute 30 second penalties. this was in no way a game. it was just like playing in some bush league summer game. I got a slashing penalty for hitting someone in the stick too hard. The ref told me he was trying to keep things lighter because it was a scrimmage. Again I am so glad we paid all this extra money to drive to texas to do so. Because colorado doesnt have any mens leagues to play in.........

So for you mr everett i guess congrats for scoring on our attackman, and taking the ball away from our defensemen playing attack. i mean congrats, really savor the moment becuase it was a game that we spent hours deliberating a game plan for. I guess you all were just such superior players and just blew us out of the water. so maybe we should down grade all of the B division becuase our team didnt win a scrimmage. I hope the feeling of victory stays with you forever. it was such a commanding win..... oh and just so you know it was westminster that won the RMLC B division. which is why they had a first round bye.

I am just very sorry for the one senior on our team Jake Smith #13. He was screwed out of his last college game ever. Thanks to the tournament for that one. He has been the biggest leader on our team, and will be missed. He led our team to nationals and gets repaid with a summer league game for his last game in college at the national tournament.
SO thanks and i hope the teams that left have severe consequences and the team that felt they couldnt compete shouldnt get the opportunity to come back.

So there it is, lets here the talk......

[warri0rlax22]

Oh and since ive noticed a lot of people starting up profiles to just talk trash with out a name,
My name is Brian Evans
I am number 22
I play for northern colorado
If you have a problem with anything i have said..... talk to me about it. you know who i am and how to reach me.

[warri0rlax22]

I realize the B Division is a work in progress, but it is ridiculous to see all the hard work MCLA people and local volunteers put into this event ALL YEAR LONG - to see some Div. B teams crap the bed at the very end.

Also im glad that our team worked so hard to make it to nationals all year long, make it and come to end up playing a summer league game, to see a team drop out and us get shafted

[Sonny]

Also im glad that our team worked so hard to make it to nationals all year long, make it and come to end up playing a summer league game, to see a team drop out and us get shafted

Consider yourself lucky that you got that final 3rd game at all.

You should direct your anger toward the program that caused this mess in the first place.

[wapiti]

Lucky they got a game at all???

I realize Irvine left, should and probably will pay the consequences, but this is crazy.

Running quarters, no scorekeepers, practivc jerseys, not very representative of a Nat'l Tourney.

Maybe if the consolation games were matched up we'd see better committment. Noone has really addressed the selection other than to say it was 'random'.

Available for the consolation games were #4 St. Thomas, #6 UNC, #7 Emory, #8 Harding, #9 Western Washington, #10 Fort Lewis, #13 Southwester, #18 Irvine.

#18 leaves, so #6 get's left out in the cold. How does that make sense......

Or look at this another way. #4 St. Thomas, #6 UNC, #7 Harding, all advanced the first day. Lost the second day, but maybe there should be a matchup there.

How about making the consolation games interesting matchups - against remaining top seeded teams. The matchips would be interesting, and better for the tournemant. If the tournament randomizes things, calls it 'just another game' - this is what you get.

I still think UNC got the shaft here, by any measure. The players comments above reflects how this team feels.

Given all that has happened I also think any comments about the quality of play is out of line. The fact that the All Stars showed up to play should be commended, but any further comments about the 'game' are probably out of line.

[Sonny]

Lucky they got a game at all???

Yep. Someone from Div. B had to draw the short end of the stick and I'm sorry that it happened to your team.

The alternative was that UNC didn't play a 3rd game at all. We could have just not played that UNC vs. All-Star Game at all. That would have been much EASIER on the staff as we wouldn't have had to scramble around and spend time & effort to organize a summer league game.

Maybe if the consolation games were matched up we'd see better committment. Noone has really addressed the selection other than to say it was 'random'.

How about making the consolation games interesting matchups - against remaining top seeded teams. The matchips would be interesting, and better for the tournemant. If the tournament randomizes things, calls it 'just another game' - this is what you get.

Maybe, maybe not. The consolation bracket hasn't been about matching up top seeded teams after they lose for many years.

I still think UNC got the shaft here, by any measure.

Yep, they sure did. But don't vent your anger at the tournament staff. Try that team from Irvine.

[jefno1]

Sonny, the question still wasn't answered, that if Irving would have stayed UNC wouldn't have played them anyway, Then why when they left is that the reasoning behind UNC not playing? Apparently UNC was to have played another team. So why didn't they? Irving leaving should have had no effect on that proposed game.

[Timbalaned]

Sonny, the question still wasn't answered, that if Irving would have stayed UNC wouldn't have played them anyway, Then why when they left is that the reasoning behind UNC not playing? Apparently UNC was to have played another team. So why didn't they? Irving leaving should have had no effect on that proposed game.

yeah it was answered earlier in this thread. if irvine stayed, they wouldnt have played unc cause they had already played this year, but that is really besides the point. like it was already said the game wouldn't have mattered. in most consolation games there are kids playing in all the wrong positions and they don't count for anything. why are you guys so mad about this game being against some lsa kids? you really need to get over it and move on. the b division has a lot of issues and they have been very accentuated this week now that i have been on staff. A lot of the teams need to take a serious look at how they operate and think about whether they want to be in this league or not.

[OAKS]

Sonny, the question still wasn't answered, that if Irving would have stayed UNC wouldn't have played them anyway, Then why when they left is that the reasoning behind UNC not playing? Apparently UNC was to have played another team. So why didn't they? Irving leaving should have had no effect on that proposed game.

Also, I believe UNC vs the A guys was set up because UNC was one of the better B teams and it was thought that they could give the all-star guys a good game. I could be wrong, but that's what my impression of the setup was.

[Zamboni_Driver]

Regional tournaments make no sense. It's a nice concept, but totally impractical. Start thinking about how the regions would be broken up, and then think about the travel costs. . .Say, Dayton travelling to Southwestern or Harding going to Westminster?. . .and then IF they win they get to travel again the next weekend to Texas? It becomes much more expensive, potentially more school missed. . .it just doesn't make financial sense.

Let's consider the scenarios - template based on A division

Current Tournament - AQ+AL:

Team of 26 players, 2 coaches, 2 managers = 30 people

If a team flies:
Flight Option = $200/person
Hotel = $35/person for 6 nights (because everyone has a chance at winning the whole thing and refundable flights/flight changes would be really expensive) = $210
Food = $40/person per day

Estimated Cost (All) = $19,500
School Days Missed = 5 or 4 (assuming make monday classes)

If a team buses:
Bus Rental = $6000 (truely just a guess, someone help)
Hotel @ $35/person
Food @ $40/person per day

Estimated Cost:
4 wins; 6 nights = $19,500...........Missed School Days = 5
3 wins; 5 nights = $17,250...........Missed School Days = 5
2 wins; 4 nights = $15,000...........Missed School Days = 5
1 win; 3 nights = $12,750............Missed School Days = 4/3
0 win; 3 nights = $12,750............Missed School Days = 4/3


Regional Play-In (1A v 2B; 2A v 1B system)

First Round- 1 week after Conference champs (saturday game)

(assume all would travel by bus)

Estimated bus @ $4000 (because it is closer, but again a guess)
Hotel @ $35/person per night (assume 1 night; friday travel for sat game)
Food @ $40

Estimated Cost (All): $6250
Missed School Days: 0/1 (depending on friday departure time)

Tournament - 1 week after 1st Round (thurs-saturday)

(assume all would travel by bus and all would stay entire tournament)

Estimated bus @ $6000 (back to original)
Hotel @ $35/per person (assume wednsday-friday = 3 nights)
Food @ $40/per person (assume 4 days)

Estimated Cost (All): $13,950 + 6250 (1st round) = $20,200
Missed school days = 3/2

Comparison: Cost (Missed School Days)

....................................AQ/AL (MSD)................... Regional (MSD)
National Champ............$19,500 (5/4).......................$20,200 (4/3)
0 Wins.........................$12,750 (4/3)........................$6,250 (1/0)

Sure these numbers aren't exact - but I don't think it is fair to claim that it is financially inconceivable. We state that from the viewpoint of the winners, not the losers. We have to consider all sides.

Now, people will question the extra cost to the league to run a 1st round. First rounds will be at normal venues, not like PHP. There would be no MCLA staff or livecast, or webstats. Granted there will still be some costs. Money freed up from renting a PHP type place for only 3 days as compared to 5 days could reallocated to fund these first rounds. (big assumption - you can rent a place like PHP for 3 days and not the entire week)

[Sonny]

You guys are absolutely killing me.

UNC (& the entire B Division) got screwed by Irvine.

Not the MCLA Executive Board.
Not the MCLA Tournament Staff.
Not by the Local Texas Volunteers.
Not by the Snack Bar Attendents at Pizza Hut Park.

Some of the Div. B consolation matchups were already determined when we realized Irvine was leaving. We scrambled to help get UNC a third final game against some of the local college players. Some of us thought that it would be a good idea to give UNC a game against some of the local LSA Div. A players since they seem to have one of the better Div. B Teams in the tourney.

And some of you are complaining about it.

The UNC senior player got another chance to see the field, yet we aren't supposed to count the results of the consolation bracket. And then some of you want UNC to play another top rated Div. B program in the consolation round.

You can't have it both ways fellas. Get a clue folks.

[Brent Burns]

I thought lacrosse is supposed to be a fun game. Being nit picky about little things, IMHO, is getting old and tiring.

Why don't you all go enjoy watching St. John's and Dayton and then the LSA Div. A semi final games this evening/tonight?

Just enjoy your time out there at PHP.